Talks with China continue in a very congenial manner - there is absolutely no need to rush

Lame sales man speech for ignorants. China isn't paying a penny. American consumers are.

mindscream

May 10, 2019 6:58am

A lot of emotions linked to hatred for Trump or the US, but the reality is, if whatever Trump is doing is insignificant, China would not have made concession to seal the deal. Emotions and realities are different things.

May 10, 2019 12:30pm — Edited

Quoting Nobody-yet

Disliked

Lame sales man speech for ignorants. China isn't paying a penny. American consumers are.

Ignored

Well, no, not quite. American consumers have a choice: forego purchases that are not urgent enough or buy stuff made elsewhere. It may be hard to believe, but the diversification of manufacturing and supply chains out of PRC had been underway even before Trump took the scene, and Made in China is probably less ubiquitous than just a few years ago.

In all cases, PRC businesses lose a sale. They may try to sell more elsewhere, probably not going to make much of an impact, because USA is the biggest importer, and the other countries are not in a mood to spend or they are PRC's mercantilist rivals themselves. If PRC firms push it, they will have to lower prices drastically, which will eat a lot of potential profit,.

CCP will have to use more stimulus to prop their struggling manufacturers. Most of the biggest ones are outright state-owned, many of the significant private ones are private only on paper, in practice they either belong to high party members, or people strongly connected to such. This stimulus will be inflationary within China, but the inflation may be partially exported abroad as well. This will make maintaining the current RMB rate very expensive and the choice will be either further reducing their foreign exchange reserves, or rapid depreciation of RMB. The former will deplete resources for the "Belt and Road", the building of islands in the south China Sea, the military modernization and the whole China 2025 ambitious plans. The latter will trigger massive capital flight and potential sanction from USA on charge of "manipulating currency".

Either way things do not look rosy for CCP. That's why Liu He swallowed the tariff slap and showed up in DC with his entourage of 100 more "officials" wearing their usual obsequious smiles.

I wonder how many of them used their diplomatic immunity to evade capital controls and bring a lot of cash to stash in their overseas bank accounts while in The Land of The Free.

May 10, 2019 11:52pm

Quoting fxsport

Disliked

{quote} but the USA is unique in that it can survive in an isolationist mode if it wanted.

Ignored

Unique? Nah. Every country can SURVIVE in an isolationist mode, that is the historical normal in fact. North Korea still manages to pull the feat. Survival is pretty easy, just not fun.

Second, why do you think once the USA goes full isolationist then suddenly everyone else will? Back in 19th and early 20th centuries, USA was about as isolationist as it gets, West European powers ran parallel (more or less global in the case of Britain and France) colonial empires, and did pretty well for themselves while it lasted. Something similar can happen again without the colonialism. Making isolationism impossible once and for all is the whole idea behind EU.

May 10, 2019 9:26am

Quoting TraderTero

Disliked

LMAO, American consumers will now start pay extra tax in order to donate food for the starving nations but DJT thinks that it is China who is paying for it..How genius is that ? Obviously very good for the starving nations. MAGA! Buy Chinese and help the poor and starving!

Ignored

You STILL don't understand how this works do you?

1. The USA increases the tariff's on the imported goods. That money is then used to purchase soybeans and other agriculture products from USA farmers.

2. The money that the USA would 'give' to countries for "foreign aid" will stay in the USA and instead the food that was purchased, using the Chinese tariff's, will be 'donated' to these countries (i.e., Central America and possibly Asian countries).

3. If the total of the increased tariff's PLUS the dollars annually sent as foreign aid countries is added together minus the amount the USA pays for the farmers products is positive then that money can/will be used for infrastructure

When the first tariff's went into effect EVERYONE predicted a recession and that it would lead to inflationary pressures. Guess What? THAT IS NOT WHAT HAPPENED!

Now with increased tariff's what's going to happen? Will consumers pay more? POSSIBLY. It depends on what is being imported. As I wrote before a lot of the import companies simply absorbed the costs of the tariff's as competition is great.

Machinist

May 11, 2019 5:28am — Edited

Quoting fxsport

Disliked

When the first tariff's went into effect EVERYONE predicted a recession and that it would lead to inflationary pressures. Guess What? THAT IS NOT WHAT HAPPENED!

Ignored

Not factual. Pressure on consumer prices has been present, just not yet as much across the board. However, coping with 25% instead of 10% will be another matter entirely…

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKCN1SD09Z

TraderTero

May 10, 2019 6:16am

LMAO, American consumers will now start pay extra tax in order to donate food for the starving nations but DJT thinks that it is China who is paying for it..How genius is that ?
Obviously very good for the starving nations. MAGA!
Buy Chinese and help the poor and starving!

TraderTero

May 10, 2019 2:02pm

Quoting fxsport

Disliked

{quote} You STILL don't understand how this works do you? 1. The USA increases the tariff's on the imported goods. That money is then used to purchase soybeans and other agriculture products from USA farmers. 2. The money that the USA would 'give' to countries for "foreign aid" will stay in the USA and instead the food that was purchased, using the Chinese tariff's, will be 'donated' to these countries (i.e., Central America and possibly Asian countries). 3. If the total of the increased tariff's PLUS the dollars annually sent as foreign...

Ignored

My point is that the money is coming from US consumers, not from China like Trump thinks is the case as he doesn't even understand who pays for the tariffs. The value of the goods donated abroad comes from US consumers. It's like if you went to a grocery store and paid for all the goods they have and then ship them at your cost to Venezuela. Then the criminals in that country sell the products to consumers for a good profit. Who do you think now has your money?
It would be better to implement a gas tax to finance the infrastructure improvement as it would help the environment at the same time (less unnecessary driving and faster transfer to electric cars).
USA will not be able to prevent China from becoming the next super power. There are no winners in a trade war.

May 10, 2019 4:42pm

Quoting fxsport

Disliked

{quote} NOT TRUE! Dear Tero, I understand with all people all over the world discussing this topic but there is something sublime that you are missing with it comes to statements from the POTUS; Trump. The increase in tariff's on imported Chinese goods will go to the USA Government, can we at least agree on that? Now who actually pays for the tariff's? I have NEVER given a penny to the USA Government for any good that I have purchased that said, "made in China"; NEVER. In fact not one USA consumer that I have ever spoken to has turned...

Ignored

1. supplier and manufacturer in China lose profit
2. they look at the result of sales before and after tariffs
3. they slow down production and give less tax in China
4. China consumes less imports in other countries
5.Other countries can buy less American goods.
6. The American consumer will be able to sell less of their products in the world.
7. If Chinese goods suddenly become more expensive, then American goods will become the same more expensive, so the American consumer pays.

alshaer

May 10, 2019 7:58pm

The United States imports about 675 billion dollars from China, while China imports 175 billion dollars from the United States with a trade deficit of nearly 500 billion dollars.
This deficit is not real because a large part of this deficit is re-flowed into the United States through American companies that have invested in China in search of cheap labor and a large part of their products are re-exported to the US market in addition to the flow of profits back home
That the imposition of tariffs on US imports from China will have a negative impact on US companies working abroad and inside and will affect the US consumer and the high inflation rates in the United States and the resulting increase in interest rates

alshaer

May 10, 2019 9:08pm

Since China will respond to the tariffs, US exports to China and US imports from China will fall in both directions, and America will receive less revenues than the president announced and will have a negative impact on economic growth in both countries.

May 10, 2019 7:08am

Quoting yanitsa

Disliked

Trump has tweeted this crap as soon as he has woken up . When exactly have they talked with China representatives ????

Ignored

I love that realDonaldTrump view:
"China would greatly slow down, and we would automatically speed up!"

gat

May 10, 2019 8:40am

China plays the long game. Trump is not caving like previous presidents who were eager to lose. About time we have a pro US negotiator. This will be settled with better results. Trade is good. Interdendancy maybe yes maybe no. Kings used to marry off daughters. This trade war is not so bad overall.

May 10, 2019 9:03am — Edited

Quoting TudorIoan

Disliked

Even great nations as the US, China, UK... can produce alone 'everything they need', protectionism is bad idea on long term. Good global trade brings more prosperity and jobs, and civil activity ... people don't have so much time to think how to start a conflict with their neighbours Wars starts when people feel poor at first, then they feel cheated, then they feel exploited, then they feeel angry ...then they see their...

Ignored

Hehehe, finally, rabid real alpha male US rough nationalists showed up here

Go, Trump!

May 11, 2019 4:33am

"but the USA is unique in that it can survive in an isolationist mode if it wanted" ...OMG, how sick is this?!

Now that's enough, Mrs. Huckabee! Too much of your personal politic agenda!
Spare us of your obssession for protectionism, isolationism, you anti-US agent!
This is no longer have anything to do with trading!

mae4206

May 10, 2019 4:36pm — Edited

Quoting TraderTero

Disliked

LMAO, American consumers will now start pay extra tax in order to donate food for the starving nations but DJT thinks that it is China who is paying for it..How genius is that ? Obviously very good for the starving nations. MAGA! Buy Chinese and help the poor and starving!

Ignored

sure he know consumers pay, tariff is to reduce china products and to buy local. is not so hard to understand

May 10, 2019 2:19pm — Edited

Quoting topor12

Disliked

{quote} Liu arrived, left. Tariffs are already there, and the world economic world will live with them. Everyone has difficulties, China or Saudi Arabia, Canada or the EU with Great Britain. The whole world has swallowed up a new reality and is waiting for the Fed to cut rates. I am waiting first for an increase in the number of applications for benefits in the region of 300-400, why? Because it will not be possible to develop your world without a general picture. China traded more with its goods, and this was determined by the buyer of America....

Ignored

I can hardly make out what this even means.

That sounds like a foreign language translated through an app. Topor or Топор, means "axe". Time zone GMT+2. Appears to be Russian. Negative attitude towards USA, fawning China, naturally.

May 12, 2019 2:09am

Quoting Guest

Disliked

{quote} At this point you are not able to replace the Chinese production with local production so in most cases people are forced to buy Chinese. It will take years to replace and you don't even have the skilled labor force to do it. Is that hard to understand? Most people posting here have no idea how the international markets and supply chains work. On top of that they unfortunately believe the populists who know as little as themselves. In no way I'm defending the Chinese trade practices but believing that a trade war can be easily won is plain...

Ignored

Why replacing Chinese production with local production is the only alternative mentioned? There are number of other countries USA can trade with. Countries who are geopolitically much more closely aligned with USA, and do not seek to upstage USA on the world arena. Lots of places in East, South East and South Asia and why not even Eastern Europe can make up for a lot of the shortfall. Those will be the true winners of the trade war.

If Trump was not attacking USA allies left right and center, all of them would cheer up USA right now.

Lest one forgets, the "Made in China" era only started en masse what, 15 years ago? The rest of the world traded just fine before that, and could do so again.

loriflori

May 10, 2019 7:04am

Quoting yanitsa

Disliked

Trump has tweeted this crap as soon as he has woken up . When exactly have they talked with China representatives ????

Ignored

They spoke last evening, and are resuming this morning.

sgmf

May 10, 2019 6:10am

nice but it is not true
btw you lost this war years ago, 2nd place is also fine...

Calin100

May 10, 2019 6:59am

If you make their exports expensive enough, at some point maybe those goods are becoming profitable being produced locally ...

))

May 10, 2019 9:39am

Mrs. Huckabee agent hazard, you people!
She already sees the tariff money collected! => pure sophism, everything that results from this is false!!!

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swing77

May 10, 2019 6:41am

nice ... NO LIGHT GREEN like the HOPE, so its a FRIDAY......., what idea next ??? i think its time for playin #OIL

May 10, 2019 9:29am

Quoting yanitsa

Disliked

Trump has tweeted this crap as soon as he has woken up . When exactly have they talked with China representatives ????

Ignored

These talks are going no where until possibly next week at the earliest but more likely not for a few months.

China informed the USA that terms that both sides had agreed to (and were written down) were not going to be honored. China agrees in terms but then backs out so Trump applied the extra tariffs to motivate them to get back to the table.

This is NOT something new - it happened ALL THE TIME but for the first time Trump tweets and allows the general public to peak behind the curtain and see the good, the bad and the ugly. If the past the USA delegation would simply roll over and just agree to 'get a deal done'. No more.

May 10, 2019 3:50pm

Quoting TraderTero

Disliked

{quote} My point is that the money is coming from US consumers, not from China

Ignored

NOT TRUE!

Dear Tero,

I understand with all people all over the world discussing this topic but there is something sublime that you are missing with it comes to statements from the POTUS; Trump. The increase in tariff's on imported Chinese goods will go to the USA Government, can we at least agree on that?

Now who actually pays for the tariff's? I have NEVER given a penny to the USA Government for any good that I have purchased that said, "made in China"; NEVER. In fact not one USA consumer that I have ever spoken to has turned money over for purchasing Chinese goods. So why do you say that the consumer pays?

The company who purchased the merchandise from the Chinese pay for tariff's. These companies have choices which are:
1. They EAT/ABSORB the tariff; i.e., it comes off the companies bottom line and the company nets less profit
2. They negotiate with the Chinese factory for either that company paying a portion of the tariff or having that company (China) lower their prices
3. They increase the price of the objects and expect the consumer to pay the higher price.

Now in the above 3 options the consumer "may" pay a portion of the tariff or they may not depending how much the company get negotiate with the supplier.

In addition the consumer who purchases these imported Chinese products has the choice of NOT PURCHASING the items. Nevertheless the USA Government gets a lot of money from the increase in tariff's. Now the USA Government can use that increase in revenue to purchase the products from the USA farmers who lost their contracts with the Chinese. Those food products can be used to donate to any country the USA Government desires.

It's really NOT that hard to understand, just confusing language.

May 10, 2019 4:00pm

Quoting topor12

Disliked

{quote} Liu arrived, left. Tariffs are already there, and the world economic world will live with them. Everyone has difficulties, China or Saudi Arabia, Canada or the EU with Great Britain. The whole world has swallowed up a new reality and is waiting for the Fed to cut rates. I am waiting first for an increase in the number of applications for benefits in the region of 300-400, why? Because it will not be possible to develop your world without a general picture. China traded more with its goods, and this was determined by the buyer of America....

Ignored

Your logic just does not apply. The globe has some interconnected pieces, mainly banking/currencies/etc., but the USA is unique in that it can survive in an isolationist mode if it wanted. The USA exports energy, food, building materials, etc.,

Japan will be an energy importer forever.....

China will be an energy importer and food importer forever.....

The USA will be a net importer of cheaply made junk forever......

A country can't live without adequate energy, food or water for its peoples.

A country CAN live without cheap/inexpensive discretionary goods for a long time.........

May 10, 2019 6:44pm

Quoting topor12

Disliked

{quote} 1. supplier and manufacturer in China lose profit 2. they look at the result of sales before and after tariffs 3. they slow down production and give less tax in China 4. China consumes less imports in other countries 5.Other countries can buy less American goods. 6. The American consumer will be able to sell less of their products in the world. 7. If Chinese goods suddenly become more expensive, then American goods will become the same more expensive, so the American consumer pays.

Ignored

I admire your thought process and most would agree, you have logical linear thinking. I however do not capitulate to that logic - try this:

1. supplier and manufacturer in China lose profit - we agree
2. they look at the result of sales before and after tariffs - we agree
3. they slow down production and give less tax in China - we agree

4. China consumes less imports in other countries - Here we have a difference BECAUSE China is government controlled. The Chinese government will 'force' their people to consume via some incentive. Now the Chinese will import LESS USA goods but the USA doesn't export those types of goods to China. The USA exports FOOD & ENERGY, so China still buys some from USA but has another country buy the FOOD then sell to China and avoids the tariff's. (this is being done in North Korea)

5.Other countries can buy less American goods. - HOW DID OTHER COUNTRIES BECOME INVOLVED? Why would other countries buy less American goods? Fake Assumption.

6. The American consumer will be able to sell less of their products in the world. - SEE ABOVE EXPLAINATION, FAKE ASSUMPTION

7. If Chinese goods suddenly become more expensive, then American goods will become the same more expensive, so the American consumer pays. ONLY IF THE AMERICAN CONSUMER BUYS THOSE GOODS. WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THE AMERICAN CONSUMER STOPS BUYING UNNECESSARY CHINESE GOODS? THEN THE AMERICAN CONSUMERS HAVE MORE MONEY TO SPEND ON USA GOODS!

yanitsa

May 10, 2019 6:58am

Trump has tweeted this crap as soon as he has woken up .
When exactly have they talked with China representatives ????

May 10, 2019 6:34am

Will Chinese goods become more expensive for Americans? will farmers sell cheaper?
(Shakespeare: -I remember some kind of porridge, but I don’t remember anything in order. There was a fight, but why — damn it knows. Lord! Himself pour poison into your mouth that turns you into a fool and beast! And also jump and rejoice about this!

blackwidowfx

May 10, 2019 6:57am

I LOVED!!!

TRUMP is The BEST!!!!

AMERICA AMERICA AMERICA

May 10, 2019 1:30pm

Quoting ekan

Disliked

{quote} Well, no, not quite. American consumers have a choice: forego purchases that are not urgent enough or buy stuff made elsewhere. It may be hard to believe, but the diversification of manufacturing and supply chains out of PRC had been underway even before Trump took the scene, and Made in China is probably less ubiquitous than just a few years ago. In all cases, PRC businesses lose a sale. They may try to sell more elsewhere, probably not going to make much of an impact, because USA is the biggest importer, and the other countries are not...

Ignored

Liu arrived, left. Tariffs are already there, and the world economic world will live with them. Everyone has difficulties, China or Saudi Arabia, Canada or the EU with Great Britain. The whole world has swallowed up a new reality and is waiting for the Fed to cut rates. I am waiting first for an increase in the number of applications for benefits in the region of 300-400, why? Because it will not be possible to develop your world without a general picture. China traded more with its goods, and this was determined by the buyer of America. There was an increase in sales. It was and will not be. The chain is interconnected, China's goods on investment in bonds of America. What now ? How do you write the difficulties of China in supporting manufacturers. Yuan exchange rate. Waiting for inflation in China. May be. And maybe not. Think or guess. China’s demand for goods was developing at a fast pace from all over the world, and the whole world traded with China, if China ceases to be with a growing economy, other countries will not be able to consume American goods. It is obvious .

May 10, 2019 2:58pm

Quoting ekan

Disliked

{quote} I can hardly make out what this even means. That sounds like a foreign language translated through an app. Topor or Топор, means "axe". Time zone GMT+2. Appears to be Russian. Negative attitude towards USA, fawning China, naturally.

Ignored

where did i say negative to usa? Where is the fact of my ingratiation before China? did you say Russian disrespectful?

Trader#6068

May 11, 2019 8:09am