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E-micro: The spot forex killer?

  • #1
  • First Post: Apr 22, 2019 5:37am Apr 22, 2019 5:37am
Unless you are living under a rock you should be aware that in a few days ( next month ) the CME will be launching a product even cheaper than the popular E-mini.

The complete set of rules are not out yet but they are finally opening the equities market to the masses.

With a few hundred bucks you will be able to open a account and take a swing at wall Street. Well at least at the "futures" part of it.

Around the internet people are saying that this move from the CME is to fill the "gap" spot Forex left for quite a few years now.

I migrated to other markets other than spot Forex many years ago because the lack of volatility.

A lot of small traders stopped trading real money for good and are trying their luck on real or online casinos, because of the lack of a market with enough volatility to prop their small accounts.

So my question.

With this new product which mimics Forex of the good old days (2006 , 2007 in my case) in volatility and affordability, and why not leverage. Will you leave Forex for good?
Don't call me. I call you!
  • #2
  • Apr 22, 2019 6:03am Apr 22, 2019 6:03am
If you have access to high leverage you can have basically all the volatility that you need.
  • #3
  • Apr 22, 2019 6:35am Apr 22, 2019 6:35am
Quoting STrading
If you have access to high leverage you can have basically all the volatility that you need.
I don't get what you are trying to say.

What my individual access ( or lack of access) to high leverage has to do with market movements?
Don't call me. I call you!
  • #4
  • Apr 22, 2019 6:38am Apr 22, 2019 6:38am
Quoting MarginCalled
{quote} I don't get what you are trying to say. What my individual access ( or lack of access) to high leverage has to do with market movements?
More liquidity!
Learn, a forex trader must, unlearn and relearn he will.
  • #5
  • Apr 22, 2019 6:51am Apr 22, 2019 6:51am
Quoting MarginCalled
{quote} I don't get what you are trying to say. What my individual access ( or lack of access) to high leverage has to do with market movements?
If a market has less volatility, you can use larger orders, tight stops and compensate for the smaller moves. For example i use orders size in EUR/USD that i would never use in GBP/USD because EUR/USD has been moving way less than GBP. In case someone does not have access to high leverage then he will be dependent of the volatility the market has.
  • #6
  • Apr 22, 2019 7:21am Apr 22, 2019 7:21am
Thanks for the clarification ST. I think we are talking in terms of apples and bananas but thats alright.

Back to the E-micro.

I did read somewhere and I'm pretty sure it was at the CME website ( gonna check later and post the link here) that they are thinking about the possibility of opening their new product to MM ( market makers).

OMG !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I can't believe that !!!!

So instead of the "relatively fairness" of the equities markets as it works right now. Where the broker does not really benefit if you lose.

They will open the E-micro to bucketshops where if you lose they win and if you win they lose.

So I guess History will repeat itself with platform freezes, disconnections, spread widening and all other gimmicks people are used to in the forex world, but this time in the futures.

Well ! I feel really sorry for the new bunch of noobs going to the slaughterhouse this time.

With the minimum wage raising I guess the big boys are salivating on those little accounts ripe to be wiped out !!
Don't call me. I call you!
  • #7
  • Apr 22, 2019 7:35am Apr 22, 2019 7:35am
e-micro = slippage
  • #8
  • Apr 22, 2019 8:47am Apr 22, 2019 8:47am
don't see why the e-micro will be more volatile than spot forex???........these two will follow each other closely.........being a new product and thinly traded at least at first, expect slippage like fx75 said.....
  • #9
  • Apr 22, 2019 11:04am Apr 22, 2019 11:04am
Slippage will definitely be a problem until it gains more popularity.

I moved to the mini nasdaq a few years ago when on a NFP friday the EUR/USD moved 20 pips !!!

Things got a little better since that day but still spot forex is nothing like when I started to trade in 2006.

The mini nasdaq gives me the moves I need in order to make money and I'm in no way thinking about the micros for myself.

But I'm very curious about which schemes they will use to plunder the new herd just getting into the new " opportunity "
Don't call me. I call you!
  • #10
  • Apr 22, 2019 11:59am Apr 22, 2019 11:59am
Quoting STrading
{quote} If a market has less volatility, you can use larger orders, tight stops and compensate for the smaller moves. For example i use orders size in EUR/USD that i would never use in GBP/USD because EUR/USD has been moving way less than GBP. In case someone does not have access to high leverage then he will be dependent of the volatility the market has.
Cost will slowly killing us,
  • #11
  • Apr 22, 2019 2:37pm Apr 22, 2019 2:37pm
Quoting MarginCalled
Slippage will definitely be a problem until it gains more popularity. I moved to the mini nasdaq a few years ago when on a NFP friday the EUR/USD moved 20 pips !!! Things got a little better since that day but still spot forex is nothing like when I started to trade in 2006.
as long as the world economies, apart from the USA and Canada, are just bumbling along with low interest rates, we wont see any volatility soon......we are just in a holding pattern at the moment, until the economy picks up everywhere and we see rising interest rates across the board.
  • #12
  • Apr 23, 2019 8:01am Apr 23, 2019 8:01am
Or you can just trade Knock-out Options (at least in Germany) and all kinds of different derivatives (leverage 1 - 800 etc) on almost every underlying. Either via exchanges or directly with banks.
  • #13
  • Apr 23, 2019 9:08am Apr 23, 2019 9:08am
There its TONS of instruments to trade, from full on fundamental based if you are into that way of trading (like oil) to soft comodities, to stocks, indices, etc etc.. and thats not even talking about time or price blocks..

There is not "volatility" (LOL)?!?!? change the instrument, use more leverage, time frame, price block, trade something else, dont be a noob !!

learn to trade and adapt to the market !!
  • #14
  • Apr 23, 2019 9:11am Apr 23, 2019 9:11am
Quoting yonnie
{quote} as long as the world economies, apart from the USA and Canada, are just bumbling along with low interest rates, we wont see any volatility soon......we are just in a holding pattern at the moment, until the economy picks up everywhere and we see rising interest rates across the board.
I don't think so yonnie. Equities ( futures in my case ) can definitely give you volatility enough to make money on it.

It is just a Forex issue. Forex does not move anymore. If you trade long term it may not matter much but for a day trader like me it just don't move enough.

I guess the money just migrated from forex to equities around 2009 or 2010 and so far did not come back.

Maybe in a few years depending on regulations and geopolitical/economical events the Forex market will reflourish.
Don't call me. I call you!
  • #15
  • Apr 23, 2019 11:21am Apr 23, 2019 11:21am
hey M, I agree with you that the low volatility is just a forex issue. In post 11 I was referring to the E/U only moving 20 pips on NFP day.
  • #16
  • Apr 23, 2019 11:30am Apr 23, 2019 11:30am
https://www.cmegroup.com/education/f...x-futures.html

Will there be on-screen market makers for the Micro E-mini products?

CME Group plans to introduce a market maker program to assure continuous two-sided markets are quoted on-screen throughout the trading day starting on launch date.

There are market makers in all the markets. Who knows, maybe the micros will pick up some volume.Increased granularity is a trader's friend, if he can learn to use it...
"If The Fool persists in his Folly he will become wise." - William Blake
  • #17
  • Apr 23, 2019 11:38am Apr 23, 2019 11:38am
lol....don't miss the webinar

https://www.cmegroup.com/cme-group-f...o-futures.html
"If The Fool persists in his Folly he will become wise." - William Blake
  • #18
  • Apr 24, 2019 11:05am Apr 24, 2019 11:05am
Quoting The Fool
https://www.cmegroup.com/education/f...x-futures.html Will there be on-screen market makers for the Micro E-mini products? CME Group plans to introduce a market maker program to assure continuous two-sided markets are quoted on-screen throughout the trading day starting on launch date. There are market makers in all the markets. Who knows, maybe the micros will pick up some volume.Increased granularity is a trader's friend, if he can learn to use it...
Thanks for pointing to the link Fool. I knew I saw it somewhere.

With the minimum wage raising in some states (and soon nationally) on that short window before inflation catches up people will have some extra income.

I guess the E-micro is aiming for this market. Meaning small accounts.

The new herd of noobs will get their accounts transferred to the MM in no time.

2006/2007 I was among them. Very hopeful, but without knowing it, walking straight to the slaughterhouse.

I remember very well Oanda freezing the platform when I was on the wrong side of the market. Or spreads widening while I was in profit and staying there until the market would come back to my entry point!!

Well one has to pay for his education , right? And yes I payed dearly !!
Don't call me. I call you!
  • #19
  • Apr 24, 2019 1:39pm Apr 24, 2019 1:39pm
Liquidity is the problem for scalpers and day Traders ( according to one broker) - so we will have to wait for this animal to get any traction to be of use to many of us.
every Saint has a past. Every Sinner has a Future
  • #20
  • Apr 24, 2019 4:22pm Apr 24, 2019 4:22pm
Volatility is at its lowest levels in years for forex, however it has been in these types of cycles before and it does snap out of it. What is needed is a fundamental event to get it going again. Equities to crash maybe? Who knows but when volatility does come back it will be explosive...
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