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  • #41
  • Mar 21, 2019 2:54am Mar 21, 2019 2:54am
Quoting EcoTrader
{quote} who cares what you did with a $100 account, anyone can turn $100 into 10k,
Well, why I write here then? I don't know, and I didn't knew. It seem I live in other world, the real world. Ok, I return to my real world.

P.S : I made from 1$ 1 billion. Everyone can do it. But not everyone show a proof.
Money moves the market, not an indicator.
  • #42
  • Mar 21, 2019 3:04am Mar 21, 2019 3:04am
Quoting andoseg2
{quote} At least I turned 100$ into 10.000$. I can't say it more clearly. Could you sustain your words with trading results? If not, then sit down and continue learn to trade. {image}
head and shoulders...
Attached Image
  • #43
  • Mar 21, 2019 3:06am Mar 21, 2019 3:06am
Quoting andoseg2
{quote} Well, why I write here then?
no idea, but you sure need to stop seeing tunnel vision.
  • #44
  • Edited 3:36am Mar 21, 2019 3:20am | Edited 3:36am
Quoting andoseg2
{quote} At least I turned 100$ into 10.000$. I can't say it more clearly. Could you sustain your words with trading results? If not, then sit down and continue learn to trade. {image}
It wasn't the head and shoulders that drove price down it was oil correlation and Canadian budget. do you honestly think professionals pump hundreds of millions into a pattern, you are deluding yourself.

Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: news.png Size: 109 KB



here is a chart for the same pair you drew your little head and shoulders on. The chart shows exactly when news has affected the pair, no little patterns, no technical analysis whatsoever, it is all news flow (aka fundamentals)

Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: ex.png Size: 138 KB
  • #45
  • Mar 21, 2019 4:04am Mar 21, 2019 4:04am
yeah fundamentals are a waste of time aren't they!!
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
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  • #46
  • Edited 11:11am Mar 21, 2019 10:59am | Edited 11:11am
Quoting andoseg2
{quote} At least I turned 100$ into 10.000$. I can't say it more clearly. Could you sustain your words with trading results? If not, then sit down and continue learn to trade. {image}
That's completely a fallacy (aka "Appeal to Authority") and nonsense in my humble opinion. You turning x into y does not imply you are at all right on your opinion or now anything about trading.

I disagree about the news and there is a solid proof for that.

After news are released you will observe huge price moves many, many standard deviations bigger than range of that moment regarding the time elapsed. High impact news is what do when the expectations (by fundamentals) and the actuals (the actual news) are different.

So news are not implicit to prices as per my experience and the statistics:

Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Screenshot1.png Size: 23 KB

Image taken from Babypips: https://www.babypips.com/learn/forex...e-trade-worthy

There is a nice dataset on Kaggle also about news impacts on Forex.
Here: https://www.kaggle.com/devorvant/economic-calendar
  • #47
  • Mar 21, 2019 11:24am Mar 21, 2019 11:24am
Quoting scherzi
{quote} That's completely a fallacy (aka "Appeal to Authority") and nonsense in my humble opinion. You turning x into y does not imply you are at all right on your opinion or now anything about trading. I disagree about the news and there is a solid proof for that. After news are released you will observe huge price moves many, many standard deviations bigger than range of that moment regarding the time elapsed. High impact news is what do when the expectations (by fundamentals) and the actuals (the actual news) are different. So news are not implicit...
If a trader wants to build a system that ignores news and fundamentals, he/she will find such a system eventually.
You obviously are not looking for it and if it is even handed to you on a platter, you will dump it in the garbage due to the very fact that it doesn't have news/fundamentals embedded in it.
It's all good though. You can trade happily your way and others can trade happily their way.
  • #48
  • Mar 21, 2019 11:34am Mar 21, 2019 11:34am
Quoting EcoTrader
{quote} It wasn't the head and shoulders that drove price down it was oil correlation and Canadian budget. do you honestly think professionals pump hundreds of millions into a pattern, you are deluding yourself. {image} here is a chart for the same pair you drew your little head and shoulders on. The chart shows exactly when news has affected the pair, no little patterns, no technical analysis whatsoever, it is all news flow (aka fundamentals) {image}
A day or two after, the job numbers came out and sent cad soaring the opposite way despite the contrary earlier numbers. The analysts were scratching their collective heads why the figures were contradicting and causing a whipsaw.
News/fundamentals are just another set of indicators with similar fallacies of any indicator. If you find such indicator works for you, great. There other ones that work just as well if not better.
  • #49
  • Mar 21, 2019 11:38am Mar 21, 2019 11:38am
Quoting EcoTrader
{quote} head and shoulders... {image}
Ricky Gravis would definitely have the last laugh on this because he makes tons of money from showing his head n shoulders in productions that cost him nothing other than to just show up.
  • #50
  • Mar 21, 2019 12:01pm Mar 21, 2019 12:01pm
Buyer and seller pkay a very important role in trading specially the market maker who can change the direction of market. In addition country economy and different factors play a very important role in market. Fluccations in currency pairs depands on possitive and negtive news in market
  • #51
  • Mar 21, 2019 12:14pm Mar 21, 2019 12:14pm
Quoting OutThere
{quote} If a trader wants to build a system that ignores news and fundamentals, he/she will find such a system eventually. You obviously are not looking for it and if it is even handed to you on a platter, you will dump it in the garbage due to the very fact that it doesn't have news/fundamentals embedded in it. It's all good though. You can trade happily your way and others can trade happily their way.
I think that if someone gives to you a system that is a winner, you should take it no matter if it includes news or not. I don't know if I am misunderstanding what you are saying.

Why should anyone reject a good system just because it includes news/fundamentals? I would not.
  • #52
  • Mar 21, 2019 12:50pm Mar 21, 2019 12:50pm
Quoting OutThere
{quote} A day or two after, the job numbers came out and sent cad soaring the opposite way despite the contrary earlier numbers. The analysts were scratching their collective heads why the figures were contradicting and causing a whipsaw. News/fundamentals are just another set of indicators with similar fallacies of any indicator. If you find such indicator works for you, great. There other ones that work just as well if not better.
Who cares what the analysts think after the fact. What makes you think sentiment should hold out for 2 days off an employment report? The fact that you mention it in this context shows you do not understand how to trade or interpret the data. The employment report was a trade opportunity, It wont now, nor will it ever be able to hold sentiment for several days. Comparing fundamentals to indicators shows a lot of naivety, which comes through in your understanding of it based on your assertion.
  • #53
  • Mar 21, 2019 12:58pm Mar 21, 2019 12:58pm
As long as one does not understand the psichology behind a trading pattern - no matter it's name, doji, head and shoulders, harami, triangle, cow, bulls, cricket, crow etc - he will remain stucked into the large amateurs groups. Ridiculising the head and shoulders pattern or any other pattern , reflect lack of fundamental knowledge about trading and usually I do not discuss with such peoples. And this time is not an exception. They are waste of time. I'm leaving this.
Money moves the market, not an indicator.
  • #54
  • Mar 21, 2019 1:08pm Mar 21, 2019 1:08pm
Quoting andoseg2
As long as one does not understand the psichology behind a trading pattern - no matter it's name, doji, head and shoulders, harami, triangle, cow, bulls, cricket, crow etc - he will remain stucked into the large amateurs groups. Ridiculising the head and shoulders pattern or any other pattern , reflect lack of fundamental knowledge about trading and usually I do not discuss with such peoples. And this time is not an exception. They are waste of time. I'm leaving this.

i can understand it well. The same patterns can be found in random data, animal migration, crime rates, birth and deaths, weather and temperature, and probably a ton more. Plenty of psychology there!
  • #55
  • Mar 21, 2019 1:29pm Mar 21, 2019 1:29pm
Quoting EcoTrader
{quote} Who cares what the analysts think after the fact. What makes you think sentiment should hold out for 2 days off an employment report? The fact that you mention it in this context shows you do not understand how to trade or interpret the data. The employment report was a trade opportunity, It wont now, nor will it ever be able to hold sentiment for several days. Comparing fundamentals to indicators shows a lot of naivety, which comes through in your understanding of it based on your assertion.
The way you have been mentioning it is like the gravy train pull up and the conductor announces the destination and you get on and then he shouts 'all abroad' and the way we go.
So its not so simple huh? You have other details and specific methods that excludes analysts? Does it exclude reading the news too? So one has to be so good to do better than analysts? If all you ate hinting at is some sort of straddle trading because you know there might be big moves either way, why not just say so? Call it what it is instead of fancy footing around news n fundamentals?

Here is something you don't understand even though you keep going on about working at brokerage firms: The news is always yesterday's news. It is called news to those who don't know better.

I have mentioned before that I also worked at brokerage firms. We knew the news even before it was announced there would be news. We knew what kind of news, the succession of them and level of importance of them. We were always loaded up days before the news and we would count down hours before release and then someone would shout "here it comes, here it comes' and then we watch our 60 cent/share stocks rise to 2 or 3 dollars. I was a junior clerk and very broke so I couldn't get in on too many deals. Also I was allowed to get on only one brokers deals out of 100 but there was hanky panky going on all the time.

So when you tell me at your brokerage firm these traders were sitting in front of monitors reading news, I have a good nice long Ricky Gravis laugh of my own.
  • #56
  • Mar 21, 2019 1:52pm Mar 21, 2019 1:52pm
Quoting OutThere
{quote} The way you have been mentioning it is like the gravy train pull up and the conductor announces the destination and you get on and then he shouts 'all abroad' and the way we go. So its not so simple huh? You have other details and specific methods that excludes analysts? Does it exclude reading the news too? So one has to be so good to do better than analysts? If all you ate hinting at is some sort of straddle trading because you know there might be big moves either way, why not just say so? Call it what it is instead of fancy footing around...
Firstly, let me correct you on an oversight on your behalf. I have never stated i have worked at a brokerage firm but keep assuming that fella. As to your reference to news and your experience at a brokerage firm, do you even realise you are referring to stock trading while the discussion here, and the forum in general (the hint is in the name), is geared towards an entirely different market that is so large, it will swallow all your stock markets and still have left overs to chew on later. Who cares how traders in the stock market reacted to economic news, it means absolutely nothing in the fx market which is dominated by news.

Quoting OutThere
{quote}
The way you have been mentioning it is like the gravy train pull up and the conductor announces the destination and you get on and then he shouts 'all abroad' and the way we go.
hell yes it is as easy as that, i do it on most trading days. By the way the firms i have worked at spend millions on news terminals. They must sure be dumb asses wasting their time when they could be like chimpy dee at some brokerage firm playing stocks with a few hundred grand.
  • #57
  • Edited 8:34pm Mar 21, 2019 8:21pm | Edited 8:34pm
Quoting EcoTrader
{quote} Firstly, let me correct you on an oversight on your behalf. I have never stated i have worked at a brokerage firm but keep assuming that fella. As to your reference to news and your experience at a brokerage firm, do you even realize you are referring to stock trading while the discussion here, and the forum in general (the hint is in the name), is geared towards an entirely different market that is so large, it will swallow all your stock markets and still have left overs to chew on later. Who cares how traders in the stock market reacted...
Well, pardon me. I thought from reading your statements in the quote below that somehow you were an employee of a brokerage firm or some kind of associate if you were allowed to be on a trading floor and moved up through trading divisions. I'm trying to think who in the brokerage firms that I worked at wasn't an employee that could do a thing like that except maybe the outside auditors and the cleaning personnel. There were so called 'promoters' that were given warrants as payment to go hustle for new clients by like the title says promote the stocks. Nothing else comes to mind, so whatever, you were there and we should take it as a credential. You just make a lot of indirect statements such as your news trading hoopla which is just the good old straddling that most everyone knows about. I guess this means I have to take everything you say with a grain of salt since it doesn't really mean what it seems to mean.

News makes stocks go up or down or stay the same just like news does the same thing to FX pairs. I guess you are just taking cheap shots. The reason I brought up stock market was because you have referred yourself as someone with a background in the market since puberty but who knows what market you were doing hanging around trading floors so I stand corrected. No Fx isn't dominated by news to the extent you say. It is dominated by many factors and one of them is news.
Trading while ignoring news and bulldozing through it's effects is easy too. I do it every day too but it's not a big deal or a novelty to me such as it is to you. It's just another candle to deal with be it a longer one. I often hear what the cause of a spike was from my trading partner. Yesterday he texted me that he was waiting for FOMC. I didn't even bother looking at the candle afterwards. I made money from it tho. Just another candle, they come and go. They are all trading opportunities. You aren't the first one to look at a big candle and say can't you see, it is a trading opportunity, it is a trading opportunity. Happy you discovered though.

The firms you worked at doing who knows what had their traders read the news? You just said who cares about analysts. If they were reading the news then it was too late. They must have been reading different takes on the news to come or at least something like stitching the small news bits together and based on economic principals make sense of them in a way to apply the findings to whatever they were trading when the big news came (Can't say they were trading stocks cause you say news doesn't apply to stocks). If they weren't doing that, then they should have had screens full of charts with oco limit orders and constantly refresh them based on results but noooo, they were just reading and reading and reading and spending millions and millions on news terminals. There must be some very expensive and exclusive news terminals that only the elite know of and can afford that make them so smart that they don't even have to look at charts any more and we should be doing the same.

You know, you are full of contradictions and grandiose about these fancy trading realms where they do all these things that us mere mortals just can't fathom to do and you have been rubbing shoulders with them so you are in the know. At the end of all that hoopla, it turns out you just skim and scan some news and lay straddle traps and most likely martingale your way out when you are wrong if you are still into the martingale/no stoploss stuff you were into when you first appeared on the board.



Quoting EcoTrader
{quote} ....I have been working with traders and analysts for years with a keen interest in the market since puberty. My first role on a trading floor was working with analysts on their research and moved up through various roles in trading divisions of investment banks and several hedge funds. It wasn't until a few years ago however when i first dipped my toes into the waters for trading. Like so many retail traders, i focused on technicals and after a while of struggles i decided to reach out to professional traders at the workplace that i had...
  • #58
  • Mar 21, 2019 8:36pm Mar 21, 2019 8:36pm
Quoting scherzi
{quote} I think that if someone gives to you a system that is a winner, you should take it no matter if it includes news or not. I don't know if I am misunderstanding what you are saying. Why should anyone reject a good system just because it includes news/fundamentals? I would not.
There are thousands of systems out there. Just run them through while ignoring news and fundamentals and if they survive, then you got your system.
  • #59
  • Mar 21, 2019 8:43pm Mar 21, 2019 8:43pm
Ask a Filipino about Ricky Gervais Filipino: Who? He's the guy who created The Office! Filipino: The what? The Office was a British sitcom that had a US version that was such a big hit in the states. It starred Steve Carrell! Filipino: Huh? Ricky hosted the Golden Globes 3 times! He was controversial yet very very funny. Filipino: Okay... He was also the singer of 80s pop group Seona Dancing Filipino: WHATTTTTT???!!! Holy shit!!! That guy is a legend!!!!!

Sounds like David Bowie: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvcoX6EQH2s

Just chilling before receiving the wrath of EcoTrader
  • #60
  • Mar 21, 2019 9:24pm Mar 21, 2019 9:24pm
Just about all threads start with a certain topic and end with a bunch of traders talking about one of these subjects

1-The market random/no, it is controlled?
2-The indicators work/looking at price action is the only way
3-It is a game of skills/ it is gambling
4-I outdid you in making money/ I made $10 into #10000000
5-Prove it/ No you prove it
6-You are an idiot/ no you are times 2
5-I have a lot of knowledge/ I know more than you think
6-I have put in a lot of dedication/ You didn't suffer in your efforts as much as me so you won't be rewarded like I am
7-Admit you are inferior/take my advice because you should.

Well, everyone is so knowledgeable and has put in the years and paid dues and is making a lot of money so what's there to worry about? One big happy family.
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