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  • #61
  • Edited 7:19pm May 25, 2018 6:27pm | Edited 7:19pm
Some final thoughts to wrap up the week with.

Although London's Friday session was successful(traded north while 1h still moved south, exited at the top of that bull candle with the arrow pointing to it) I felt it differed from my usual MO which is to trade only in the direction of the 1h trend. Is that an efficient use of my time though? to sit and wait for the trend to kick back in. What if there are other opportunities to be had?
What should my MO have been during that long trade last night? Hit and run? take the 30-40 pips and get out? I was trading against the 1h trend. Or maybe hit and run and leave scout in with the possibility of trend ride should the market break above the white line marked on the chart(confirming reversal of down trend HL HH). Was I trying to pick a bottom(predicting,rigidity)? or just take a quick opportunity of buying into the buyers area and making a few pips (trading the dance)?

I think as I get better at reading terrain i will begin to know the answers to these questions. Learning to modify my MO to the terrain on the left side of the chart and the unfolding information on the right. More experience is needed before i know which MO's to adopt and when, what i can and cant get away with. Obviously there are many scenarios and possibilities on how i could've traded that. It all comes down to "pre-planned sequences, extemporaneous responses." Non-rigidity. If this, then what?

I'll probably slow down on doing these long posts and start posting more trade oriented posts. Just wanted to put questions i was having here so i remember them and to document my learning process. Also, maybe other taf vets can offer their insights or point out any faulty mindset issues i may develop along the way. Or for anyone who is on the same learning path if they find this thread maybe they'll get something out of it.
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  • #62
  • Edited 1:19am May 27, 2018 1:07am | Edited 1:19am
Quoting SolidSnake-
{quote} Dustin, I think Franco is trying to tell you, you have no need for those MA's on your charts.
Never said that. I made a simple question.

The use of MAs is another complex issue. Neither easy nor simple.
They are another tool at our disposal (a sort of crutch or training wheel, if you want... or much, much more if you know how...)
It all depends by our intentions/purposes, objectives and aims and by what we are searching for in that specific analysis.
Are you a Trend Trader or a Lines Trader?
Depends! Which are the relationship between Trends and MAs? (and which MAs?)

It's a long, long, story: nothing is simple in Trading.
Just remember always what they are (averages!) and what they mean on the Ground (this not so easy to catch in the proper way!)
I use them intensively... and fti knows that very well.
He noticed it immediately and immediately understood that I am not a slave of them.

I feel better and I see better using two charts one with MAs and one without.
So... they are just another tool that you MUST learn to use: another implement in the successful trader's tool box.
  • #63
  • Edited 3:38am May 27, 2018 2:17am | Edited 3:38am
Quoting dbrown101
It all comes down to "pre-planned sequences, extemporaneous responses." Non-rigidity. If this, then what?
EDITED
IMHO
Your reasoning seems OK. (... but remember that I'm mr No One! We are all students of this dynamic business called trading!)
You seem to be on the right path. Go on with faith.

What is a Trend? (That chart is answering to you, that chart is trying to tell you something...)
Embedded Trends? Now Trend? Which Trend do you wanna trade (are you trying to trade, LOL)?
Do you see clearly which one is the Impulse and which the Correction?
When THAT Trend must be considered changed? Do you see the boundaries for your mission (with the trend or counter trend)?

If so... you could Dance properly. (And I mean: even both ways... if needed!)

To trade correctly we need clear Rules on all that: pre-planned sequences (and, plus, if, in case... extemporaneous response). Correct!!!
Remove ignorance, fear, greed and regrets.
Rules, determination and no doubts.

Good work to everybody.
  • #64
  • Edited 4:17am May 27, 2018 2:29am | Edited 4:17am
Quoting dbrown101
Some final thoughts to wrap up the week with...... .....

Look at d1 it shows what went on too.. ..my bias was short but I went long for a bit in potential correction - watching zones on d1/h1 - as price was telling me that but my numbers not as strong as momentum not as good ..not as good as I thought ...and if we want to go short while it is going long we need to wait for topping action which came at d1 h1 zone. Think what you are feeling is part of the education non rigid but with solid foundation (terrain: trending (what is a trend) - ranging - coiling - a mess/who knows/flighty)...and scouts are useful for feeling it ...which trend are we trading ...what is price telling me ...scout it. I have same fears.


Alex
check out the terrain - follow never lead
  • #65
  • Edited 4:57am May 27, 2018 3:16am | Edited 4:57am
Quoting SolidSnake-
{quote} .....attacking, I prefer a little rescue that goes into trend....

I find this hard too - have you studied FTI example on TAF for as above so below example with good momentum/feel?

In that first white play: impulse + abc to c. 50% retrace - scouts in wave 1 (or D) going down nicely no strong momentum - wave 2 (or E) pullback (not impulse) strong momentum turn down - send in 2 after H L LH LL super strong feel full attack in wave F to attack support. Inside this I think he is checking out how much buying/selling going on - where orders are at/how strong they are/who are they.

Look at blue and purple examples too - they do help. Both white + purple= same -> impulse + abc + de (non impulse) attack f

Also Jupiter/Donsky/Phil threads - show what they are doing - learn from others - great thing to do. Hope this helps.

Alex
check out the terrain - follow never lead
  • #66
  • May 28, 2018 6:09am May 28, 2018 6:09am
Quoting Jupiter
{quote} Never said that. I made a simple question .
Sorry my bad. Great post, I've read it over and over again.

Quoting alexandria
{quote} I find this hard too - have you studied FTI example on TAF for as above so below example with good momentum/feel?

Also Jupiter/Donsky/Phil threads - show what they are doing - learn from others - great thing to do. Hope this helps. Alex
Thanks Alex, I'm still reading... not finish with reading all yet. As I can't learn to dance by reading alone, so I thought I might as well get my feet wet as I continue to read up.

I intend to read everything, including Dongsky, Franco and Phil's threads.

Thanks again Alex.
When U allow your emotions to dictate your decisions, U make bad decision
  • #67
  • May 28, 2018 6:30am May 28, 2018 6:30am
Quoting SolidSnake-
{quote} Exactly my thought. Rescue in... {image}
Was in needless prolong battle that I could have exited. I've got 2 left feet, so I'm going to need to learn to dance a whole lot better and develop, so I could start feeling its pulse. No where near that right now.

All squared from last week. No trading today.
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When U allow your emotions to dictate your decisions, U make bad decision
  • #68
  • Edited May 29, 2018 12:42am May 28, 2018 10:51pm | Edited May 29, 2018 12:42am
Quoting alexandria
{quote} I find this hard too - have you studied FTI example on TAF for as above so below example with good momentum/feel? In that first white play: impulse + abc to c. 50% retrace - scouts in wave 1 (or D) going down nicely no strong momentum - wave 2 (or E) pullback (not impulse) strong momentum turn down - send in 2 after H L LH LL super strong feel full attack in wave F to attack support. Inside this I think he is checking out how much buying/selling going on - where orders are at/how strong they are/who are they. Look at blue and purple examples...

Alex,

Thank you for sharing your insights into FTI's example attack sequence. I think this is the one you are referring to.
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I've pondered over this example many times. I know this is only one scenario as FTI mentioned and there are many variations and possibilities. This type of attack is pretty aggressive but i think it holds the key(or at least 1 key) to being efficient in the markets. still getting the hang of it all as it seems like its pretty fast paced. I am unsure which waves to be playing.Maybe you can help me understand a little better...

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Above is an example i just took from the Eur/usd 5min. According to the FTI example, would I be playing the smaller a-f's with the attack sequence with a scout going in "ab" or at the top of "bc" (retrace) if first impulse "ab" was missed. Then send a checker at wave "cd" and so on and so forth? Or would I be playing the larger waves I've marked on the chart with scout in at AB....

I understand entries and size would probably be a little different in this instance due to the scenario FTI presented was an example if CD played above EF as described in this post-----> https://www.forexfactory.com/showthr...31#post1845331(he also said this attack sequence was only invoked when the markets were active and range play of legs were 50 pips--not quite sure of which leg he is taking about? a-f(AB)? or ab,cd,ef impulses? markets dont seem that active anymore.)

all of this is hypothetical and im not trying to be an FTI clone. Also, not looking for a rigid sequence .Just trying to try to see what he is seeing.

also I think this is a important part of the strategy------>

Quote
It would require that I would attack full force 5, 11 before the break away r/s point( normally somewhere in the mid of AF's range, and would be drawing the attack total of 16 in batches as we test into the r/s depending on the volatility whereby the market is taking that r/s out. Then upon the test, profitaking of the attack sequense would be invoked into the stops-break on the reverse 8,5,3.

In fti's example he draws half of the final attack out at the resistance line where the pin bar at the bottom of AB formed( where buyers might be lurking). probably to leave a cushion of profits should there be any expected surprises at that level.

Any way that's my take...

haven't attempted this type of aggressive attack because im still learning. Just wanting to discuss strategy.
  • #69
  • May 29, 2018 12:17am May 29, 2018 12:17am
Alex,

also.... what is your take on the blue numbers? FTI invoking rescue sequence? then getting out at the blue +4 to wait for the next impulse down(purple)?
  • #70
  • May 29, 2018 1:42am May 29, 2018 1:42am
tonight:

just caught a wave down on the Eur/usd. removed scout because price stalled around BRN 1.1600. was expecting a retrace now its dropping further...
wanted to note this because i feel rigid thinking took me out of the trade. still learning... +23 pips
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  • #71
  • May 29, 2018 1:48am May 29, 2018 1:48am
waiting for retrace to see if i can get in again...being cautious as the D1 chart is nearing support zone from Nov 2017.
  • #72
  • May 29, 2018 1:53am May 29, 2018 1:53am
Quoting dbrown101
tonight: just caught a wave down on the Eur/usd. removed scout because price stalled around BRN 1.1600. was expecting a retrace now its dropping further... wanted to note this because i feel rigid thinking took me out of the trade. still learning... +23 pips {image} {image}
Hi Dustin

Nothing wrong about banking pips my friend, it is often when we try to squeeze every pip out of a run that we come unstuck, now European to London opens is the hour we often see the MM’s make a false (stop/order run) move, so please be wary of this when trading. Are they doing it now??? Only time will tell.

Regards

Phil.
-be careful about what you allow to be put in your mind-
  • #73
  • May 29, 2018 2:04am May 29, 2018 2:04am
Quoting phil13
{quote} Hi Dustin Nothing wrong about banking pips my friend, it is often when we try to squeeze every pip out of a run that we come unstuck.
Nothing wrong with it at all. Im still learning. trying to keep the mindset in check i guess.

Quote
now European to London opens is the hour we often see the MM’s make a false (stop/order run) move, so please be wary of this when trading.

Thank you for the heads up!!! Good info to be aware of. Lets watch and see...

thank you!
  • #74
  • May 29, 2018 2:09am May 29, 2018 2:09am
Hi Dustin

no problem, also watching the 3K's at this time i find can often be very helpful to help see the real reasoning behind the move.

regards

Phil.
-be careful about what you allow to be put in your mind-
  • #75
  • May 29, 2018 2:21am May 29, 2018 2:21am
Quoting phil13
{quote} Hi Dustin Nothing wrong about banking pips my friend, it is often when we try to squeeze every pip out of a run that we come unstuck, now European to London opens is the hour we often see the MM’s make a false (stop/order run) move, so please be wary of this when trading. Are they doing it now??? Only time will tell. Regards Phil.
are these moves something like this ? break out running short stops and trapping long traders before "rubber-band snapback".

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  • #76
  • May 29, 2018 2:34am May 29, 2018 2:34am
Quoting dbrown101
{quote} are these moves something like this ? break out running short stops and trapping long traders before "rubber-band snapback". {image}

Hi Dustin

Note that they have taken out both the last Asian session high and low (stop/order areas).

Yes, that is often what they do here at around these times, you will also note it at around NY open too, but is does not happen as much as they do it now, we have not had US session yet this week and the market likes to see what the wheel (USD) is doing often before it creates a sustained direction.

And as you correctly stated the E/U is currently in a (suspected) buyers area on the daily chart.

Regards

Phil.
-be careful about what you allow to be put in your mind-
  • #77
  • Edited 3:11am May 29, 2018 2:47am | Edited 3:11am
Quoting dbrown101
{quote} .......... I know this is only one scenario as FTI mentioned and there are many variations and possibilities. ....... Above is an example i just took from the Eur/usd 5min. According to the FTI example, would I be playing the smaller a-f's.....................
Yup lots of different terrains and that is FTI attack so basically impulse + abc then scout in, checker in, next level in + full attack (his force of 20) - we can work out what we will do for ourselves and what we can afford/skilled to handle - and this is when all the heavens align and with full momentum on the attack down. There are other examples in the thread and peeps journals for what they would do in situations but up to us what we can handle in different terrains. Terrain could be wide ranging (scout only) or coiling (stay out for now they are sweeping both sides) or a mess (stay out !).....

I do not personally note counts or numbers on waves.. don't do that stuff. Trends can build waves for ever.

From what you have shown on your example:the first wave up is a correction wave A and you want to enter long on the B wave to trade the C wave - not sure what you are trying to do)? - Although trading short after C wave is on the cards really If you intend to go long (small nos only as retracing) after A you would be expecting a retrace B wave so get in on that at bottom of range at support and start of C wave (L H HL) - you can scout where you want to up to you look for sensible place to enter (at support or when C wave starts running in your direction) or go with feel. Of course what you think of as B wave could be start of strong run down. If trading C wave where could it run into selling on left of chart for you to worry about (take profit on any long). If you are going short (better) and get in too early - say you have 2 men in and in trouble: options take em out and get in again at more favourable time (starting with 2 scouts in trouble as your base) or leave and take pain and rescue later (can you afford/handle that?) - look at higher time frames if necessary for longer term terrain. Not sure if that helps you or not. I once asked FTI about being in on a wave B in live session- he told me when C starts and it was clear to me I was in abc kill the scouts (i had 2 in) and get in later at end of C - also if it retraces > 50% of impulse then trend is weaker so wait for strong confirmation trend is back on before getting in at start at trend run using nos as 2 4 ....... ( I had 1 1 (in trouble) so 2 are new base) so 2 (in trouble) 2 4 6...).


We need to have a plan before we trade - what is terrain, higher time frames, news, RoK, time of day eg London opening - where are potential buy orders and sell orders - then what is it doing in the now.

Not trading today got stuff on.


Alex.
check out the terrain - follow never lead
  • #78
  • May 29, 2018 2:54am May 29, 2018 2:54am
Hi Dustin

So now we can see the 3K’s are not in sync for this session, this means there are other political things driving the market, we must remember to also take into account what may be going on fundamentally in the market, just chart analyses on its own will not give us an edge.

The 3K’s are very good for this in giving clues where to take our analyse from.

Regards

Phil.
-be careful about what you allow to be put in your mind-
  • #79
  • May 29, 2018 2:55am May 29, 2018 2:55am
Quoting phil13
{quote} Hi Dustin Note that they have taken out both the last Asian session high and low (stop/order areas). Yes, that is often what they do here at around these times, you will also note it at around NY open too, but is does not happen as much as they do it now, we have not had US session yet this week and the market likes to see what the wheel (USD) is doing often before it creates a sustained direction. And as you correctly stated the E/U is currently in a (suspected) buyers area on the daily chart. Regards Phil.
Lot's to be aware of in this business. I can see why many fail and/or give up. I will make note of these things. Thank you again for the heads up!

Dustin
  • #80
  • May 29, 2018 3:27am May 29, 2018 3:27am
Quoting alexandria
{quote}I do not personally note counts or numbers on waves.. don't do that stuff. Trends can build waves for ever.
Either do I which is why my post was probably confusing. Its not something Ive dabbled in too much so the waves probably aren't correctly labeled. I guess i was trying to see if the 20 entries would be played out in the shorter term smaller waves vs the bigger waves. Sorry if i am not making sense. I am not well versed in wave counts.
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