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  • #141
  • Dec 20, 2017 6:32pm Dec 20, 2017 6:32pm
Nice to see people using MML

as I am not megalomaniac I prefer to rename them SRL - Support & Resistance Lines whose name is self-explanatory

about Murrey / Gann Support and Resistance Lines

1) Gann first used the division by 8 of the interval between a Low and a High - additional question how to choose the Low and the High

2) Gann / Murrey used a different version of above methodology by using a "fractal version" - 0/1, 0/10, 0/100,0/1000, 0/10.000 etc

this version has the advantage to be more "stable" and to allow comparisons between all financial supports fluctuating within the same price range

3) fact is you can use the same methodology with whatever interval because you can "slice" it in 1/100 th
  • #142
  • Dec 20, 2017 7:34pm Dec 20, 2017 7:34pm
The Gann Law of Vibration (LOV) was approximated by the division by 8 of whatever interval you use which gives you a parabolic curve

Division by 8 of an interval is an approximation of the Fibonacci number serie
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: MASTERMIND PARABOLIC CURVE.jpg Size: 170 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: FIBONACCI 0-10.jpg Size: 62 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: FIBONACCI 0-100.jpg Size: 54 KB
  • #143
  • Dec 20, 2017 7:38pm Dec 20, 2017 7:38pm
compare the form of both charts

you just have to divide the Mastermind Price Range of the chart by 100.000
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
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Click to Enlarge Name: MASTERMIND PARABOLIC CURVE.jpg Size: 170 KB
  • #144
  • Dec 20, 2017 7:45pm Dec 20, 2017 7:45pm
Quoting RapzyFX
{quote} I think you are very wrong on this but I also understand your thinking which I believe is as a result of this testing phase where we just pick pairs to trade randomly but its still not completely random. There is a process even in this testing phase. Read post one again. The first thing you should note is that you must have two same Base?Quote currencies in any pair. This alone puts you to work in deciding which to pick and eliminates a huge percentage of randomness at least in choosing pairs. Other elements of randomness would be totally...
I think you are picking randomly when it comes to trading more than 1 set of TS. That is why I mentioned in my previos posts that instead of picking any TS set we should concentrate on pairs that are close to extreme levels of mml(post#29)
I actually mentioned that I am having success with just trading pairs that are at extreme mml levels with 4:1 rr.
meaning I am not triangulating but just picking favorable trades.
uff Im tired of typing, lol.
  • #145
  • Dec 20, 2017 7:58pm Dec 20, 2017 7:58pm
Quoting RapzyFX
{quote} I was referring to the quiz on lot sizes and sl you posted where only one person attempted and not that traders won't like to make those calculations to trade. If you must trade this then calculating lot sizes and sl is a must ofcourse. What I meant concerning MML settings for H1,H4 etc was: Normal H1 settings - P=64, MMP=60 but this should be used in the M15 TF; Normal H4 settings - MMP = 240 but applied to M15 or H1 TF I think this will draw the HTF lines on the lower TF which will give stronger rejection areas. I think using MN1 MML lines...
Thanks for the settings that you would apply.

However, they are very different to the ones that I would apply on higher TFs when trading the MTTTM Strategy.

Projected TPs can apply HTF at P=64 settings in general provided a minimum 4 to 1 reward to risk ratio is adhered too.
Most traders might find it easier to simply know that for every TP it has to be 4 times as many pips as the stop loss.
An MML trader would know that price often hits the next MML lines on HTFs (trading on an M15 TF but TP set off a D1 MML line for example).

You are starting to think along the same lines as me in terms of Octave Gaps being too wide ... this is worthy of consideration for sure.

There is a trick to the process that I use which considers the stops, TPs and ADRs on a per pair basis and how well it fits within the MML Grid.

The PA should be considered and an opinion formed on the likelihood that price will actually hit the TP level.
Of course the answer is not known in advance but the trader should apply a reasonable and realistic approach.

On higher TFs a trader should have analyzed previous data (historical) to form an expectation of how long a setup might take to complete.
Again you never know in advance how long a future setup will take to complete but you can certainly form a pretty good opinion.

Looking at the ranges in price that typically occur over a period of time allows a time line to be set (not fixed but expected).

On smaller TFs such as M5 and M15 the settings (P=64, MMP=60) I have provided in the template are 'good enough' for most pairs but not for all.

So the P=64 and MMP=60 settings are a best fit in general for the majority of pairs on the lower TFs (not the HTFs).

Thinking is good as it adds value to the discussions and might even improve parts of the strategy.

Masterrmind.............
Master your Mind then Master your Trades
  • #146
  • Dec 20, 2017 8:03pm Dec 20, 2017 8:03pm
Quoting AndyU
{quote} 5th scenario
Ok but I will make a final volatility (likely) assessment of the market and either open a TS or not.

Clearly this is not really the best time to be opening a TS Order 3 in general because the PA is very likely to die out.

This would make hitting the TPs a difficult task.

The other point is that it will not look very good to have several trades open and price going no where.

Yes I am painting a bad picture here and who knows the volatility might remain but I see it as unlikely.

What do other traders have to say about this ?

Masterrmind............
Master your Mind then Master your Trades
  • #147
  • Dec 20, 2017 8:08pm Dec 20, 2017 8:08pm
Quoting parisboy
Nice to see people using MML as I am not megalomaniac I prefer to rename them SRL - Support & Resistance Lines whose name is self-explanatory about Murrey / Gann Support and Resistance Lines 1) Gann first used the division by 8 of the interval between a Low and a High - additional question how to choose the Low and the High 2) Gann / Murrey used a different version of above methodology by using a "fractal version" - 0/1, 0/10, 0/100,0/1000, 0/10.000 etc this version has the advantage to be more "stable" and to allow comparisons between all financial...
Nice addition to the discussion.

Anytime Gann is added into the conversation it adds plenty of value in my opinion.

Masterrmind.............
Master your Mind then Master your Trades
  • #148
  • Dec 20, 2017 8:11pm Dec 20, 2017 8:11pm
Quoting hibra68
{quote} I think you are picking randomly when it comes to trading more than 1 set of TS. That is why I mentioned in my previos posts that instead of picking any TS set we should concentrate on pairs that are close to extreme levels of mml(post#29) I actually mentioned that I am having success with just trading pairs that are at extreme mml levels with 4:1 rr. meaning I am not triangulating but just picking favorable trades. uff Im tired of typing, lol.
If you pick just pairs at the extreme MML levels then you are likely to do quite ok in your trading.

The higher the TFs though generally the safer and better you might perform.

Strict adherance to MM and no reason your account won't shine.

Masterrmind............
Master your Mind then Master your Trades
  • #149
  • Dec 20, 2017 9:54pm Dec 20, 2017 9:54pm
Quoting AndyU
{quote} 5th scenario
Even if I don't decide to trade the TS Order 3 I will still outline the lot size calculations.

5th Scenario is as follows (refer Post 62)

Scenario 5
TS 1 = AUDNZD + AUDJPY = NZDJPY
TS 2 = EURUSD + GBPUSD = EURGBP
TS 3 = AUDCAD + GBPCAD = GBPAUD

Scenario 5 is simply the reverse of Scenario 1

6 pairs traded short and 3 pairs traded long

The Lot sizes are calculated as follows:

Account Balance = 11 100.76
Assigned Risk per trade = 1% = 1/100*11 100.76 = 111

Pair 1 = AUDNZD
Octave gap is 15.3
Pip Value is 7.00
Lot Size = 111/[15.3*7.00] = 1.04 lots
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Screenshot1.png Size: 71 KB

Pair 2 = AUDJPY
Octave gap is 9.8 pips
Pip Value is 8.82
Lot Size = 111/[9.8*8.82] = 1.28 lots
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Screenshot2.png Size: 69 KB

Pair 3 = NZDJPY
Octave gap is 19.5 pips
Pip Value is 8.82
Lot Size = 111/[19.5*8.82] = 0.65 lots
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Screenshot3.png Size: 68 KB

Pair 4 = EURUSD
Octave gap is 15.3 pips
Pip Value is 10
Lot Size = 111/[15.3*10] = 0.73 lots
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Screenshot4.png Size: 68 KB

Pair 5 = GBPUSD
Octave gap is 15.3 pips
Pip Value is 10
Lot Size = 111/[15.3*10] = 0.73 lots
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Screenshot5.png Size: 66 KB

Pair 6 = EURGBP
Octave gap is 15.3 pips
Pip Value is 13.36
Lot Size = 111/[15.3*13.36] = 0.54 lots
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Screenshot6.png Size: 67 KB

Pair 7 = AUDCAD
Octave gap is 7.6 pips
Pip Value is 7.80
Lot Size = 111/[7.6*7.80] = 1.87 lots
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Screenshot7.png Size: 71 KB

Pair 8 = GBPCAD
Octave gap is 15.3 pips
Pip Value is 7.80
Lot Size = 111/[15.3*7.80] = 0.93 lots
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Screenshot8.png Size: 70 KB

Pair 9 = GBPAUD
Octave gap is 15.3 pips
Pip Value is 7.67
Lot Size = 111/[15.3*7.67] = 0.95 lots
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Screenshot9.png Size: 70 KB

Direction:

AUDNZD
AUDJPY
NZDJPY
EURUSD
GBPUSD
EURGBP
AUDCAD
GBPCAD
GBPAUD

Note: Once the octave gaps and pip values have been applied and the lot sizes calculated these values will be locked for this TS Order 3 setup!

Masterrmind.............
Master your Mind then Master your Trades
  • #150
  • Dec 20, 2017 10:23pm Dec 20, 2017 10:23pm
Quoting Masterrmind
{quote} Even if I don't decide to trade the TS Order 3 I will still outline the lot size calculations. 5th Scenario is as follows (refer Post 62) Scenario 5 TS 1 = AUDNZD + AUDJPY = NZDJPY TS 2 = EURUSD + GBPUSD = EURGBP TS 3 = AUDCAD + GBPCAD = GBPAUD Scenario 5 is simply the reverse of Scenario 1 6 pairs traded short and 3 pairs traded long The Lot sizes are calculated as follows: Account Balance = 11 100.76 Assigned Risk per trade = 1% = 1/100*11 100.76 = 111 Pair 1 = AUDNZD Octave gap is 15.3 Pip Value is 7.00 Lot Size = 111/[15.3*7.00] = 1.04...
TS Order 3 via Scenario 5 is now active in the market.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Screenshot1.png Size: 33 KB

Masterrmind.............
Master your Mind then Master your Trades
  • #151
  • Dec 20, 2017 10:33pm Dec 20, 2017 10:33pm
GBPCAD

This is an interesting order in that I am forced to apply a Sell Limit order due to the proximity of price to the lower extreme MML zone.

Typically a long entry would be considered from this level in the MML Grid ... but not so when applying this forced Scenario 5.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Screenshot1.png Size: 77 KB

Effectively I want price to drive up the chart trigger my short entry and then close 4 octaves lower at the -2/8 MML inside MML Grid.

There are a few other trades on other pairs that breach the upper limits of the MML Grid (not really preferred) but it is within an octave.

Note that the scario I'm being forced to trade is not really suitable to the PA within the MML Grid.

But it will be traded nonetheless so hold on tight !

Masterrmind............
Master your Mind then Master your Trades
  • #152
  • Dec 20, 2017 10:43pm Dec 20, 2017 10:43pm
NZDJPY

This trade was entered long at market close to the 7/8 MML.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Screenshot1.png Size: 83 KB

It could have been entered via a Buy Limit order with an entry from the 6/8 MML so that TP 4 octaves up the chart would hit the +2/8 MML.

This is an example of setting a TP that breaches the upper boundary of the MML Grid which is not preferred.

Masterrmind.............
Master your Mind then Master your Trades
  • #153
  • Dec 20, 2017 10:44pm Dec 20, 2017 10:44pm
Perhaps you could check GBPCAD order?
  • #154
  • Dec 20, 2017 10:49pm Dec 20, 2017 10:49pm
Quoting harry99
Perhaps you could check GBPCAD order?
Hi harry99,

The GBPCAD order is set correctly.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Screenshot1.png Size: 76 KB

However, under current market conditions price is perhaps unlikely to move high enough today to trigger the order (its about 45 pips away).

Still the order has to be placed.

Lerts see.

Masterrmind.............
Master your Mind then Master your Trades
  • #155
  • Dec 20, 2017 10:54pm Dec 20, 2017 10:54pm
Quoting Masterrmind
NZDJPY This trade was entered long at market close to the 7/8 MML. {image} It could have been entered via a Buy Limit order with an entry from the 6/8 MML so that TP 4 octaves up the chart would hit the +2/8 MML. This is an example of setting a TP that breaches the upper boundary of the MML Grid which is not preferred. Masterrmind.............
If NJ turns positive before it hits the current stop I may close it out and reapply the correct settings for that order.

Trading longs from the 7/8 MML is against the guidelines.

Masterrmind............
Master your Mind then Master your Trades
  • #156
  • Dec 20, 2017 10:57pm Dec 20, 2017 10:57pm
Notice how the Octave gaps are smaller on several of the pairs this time around.

Smaller stops can mean greater stop outs.

Lets see.

Masterrmind.............
Master your Mind then Master your Trades
  • #157
  • Dec 21, 2017 12:36am Dec 21, 2017 12:36am
So this time we chose any random TS and ended up with some pairs that are at not ideal MML lines. I guess giving a little analysis to select pairs with better current locations on MML grid would put odds a little bit in our favor compared to totally random picking. There's a nice MML grid dashboard indicator to help with that.

GBPCAD is extremely unlikely to be profitable, octave gap (=stop loss) is too small to pick exact turning point. Same thing I'm seeing with MML grid on EURAUD. At London open it will be 30 pips or more very quickly.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
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  • #158
  • Dec 21, 2017 12:41am Dec 21, 2017 12:41am
update on my TS3: 5 losers, 2 winners, 1 going strong (3/4 to PT completed), 1 canceled (did not reopen it because price was far far away from original pending order).
  • #159
  • Dec 21, 2017 4:01am Dec 21, 2017 4:01am
According to GANN the keypoint is the understanding of the Time Price Relationship in Trading.

This is your Scaling which translates in the reality The Time and Price Relationship

The division by 8 of an interval of Price mimics the graphical representation of the Fibonacci serie

To have a "correct" and efficient scaling whatever Time Unit you use , your Time Frame has ALSO to be divisble by 8

Hereunder the relationship between the Time frame and the Musical Octave
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: OCTAVE VIBRATION.jpg Size: 61 KB
  • #160
  • Dec 21, 2017 6:24am Dec 21, 2017 6:24am
Quoting AndyU
So this time we chose any random TS and ended up with some pairs that are at not ideal MML lines. I guess giving a little analysis to select pairs with better current locations on MML grid would put odds a little bit in our favor compared to totally random picking. There's a nice MML grid dashboard indicator to help with that. GBPCAD is extremely unlikely to be profitable, octave gap (=stop loss) is too small to pick exact turning point. Same thing I'm seeing with MML grid on EURAUD. At London open it will be 30 pips or more very quickly. {image}...
Yes thats the basic idea.

Applying the MML Grid and especially trading from the extreme zones is where possible reversals in price occur.

But they occur at other MMLs as well and on different TFs.

So theyneed to be put into context.

What I tend to look for is multiple layers of confluence (more about this in my Quad Candle System thread).

The market will drive price wherever it wishes so ultimately as smart traders we need to only allocate a small risk of the account in zones that we view as opportunistic ... if we get it wrong no major harm done to the trading account.

Yes I have this MML dash as well.

I have not introduced it here since the key idea initially with the MTTTM Strategy was to trade it almost mechanically.

As the involvement increases then informative dashes can be implemented ... all good.

Masterrmind.............
Master your Mind then Master your Trades
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