Can someone explain why these zones did not worked out?
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Trading Institutional Order Flow
- #5,202
- Nov 27, 2017 12:10pm Nov 27, 2017 12:10pm
- | Commercial User | Joined Jan 2016 | 2,682 Posts
Be careful what you think because your thoughts run your life..Solomon
- #5,205
- Nov 27, 2017 2:12pm Nov 27, 2017 2:12pm
- | Commercial User | Joined Jan 2016 | 2,682 Posts
Hello, everybody! I've got 3 questions. All regarding the rule of zones needing to accomplish something before they are considered to be valid. Q #1 {image} Zone B broke momentum line and zone A, therefore, is inherited zone. Now, if the price falls as far as C from B, and then comes back to B, making D on its way, here, my question arises. When setting up the trade, my risk is the B zone (+ some protection against spikes and not getting filled), that's obvious. But when we talk about the reward, is it correctly drawn in the example? Will we TP...
Welcome to T.I.O.F
Good to meet you
To answer your questions as precisely as is humanly type-able
:1. It is difficult to describe an answer here because it is a stick drawing. In deciding whether or not a zone is to be "ignored" a top down analysis is what dictates that (in actual fact, more accurately speaking, no zones is ever ignored, it is more of the quality and context of the zone that determines the probabilities to be attached to it
2. The zone you refer to was not ignored. It was just not considered to have enough quality to stop price, it was already tested. Again, taking the entry timeframe alone is not enough information for one to make a decision or judgement on this. A lot more goes into it than trading zones on one chart
3. if i am reading this last part correctly, i think you have that concept of validity the wrong way round. If "zone 2" takes out "zone 3", it validates zone 2 not zon
There is a lot more information that is incorporated into making the decision to take any given trade. The foundational concept is Multiple time frame analysis.
best wishes
Be careful what you think because your thoughts run your life..Solomon
{quote} Hello T4i thank you for sharing your thoughts on the USDCAD I concur. We need to work on your zone isolation techniques though. thanks again for sharing best wishes
what would you say about this? I should be looking for buy opportunities right?
to be honest, it looks so easy when you plot this supply & demand zones on your charts.
when I plot my zones I always think to complicated.
I know practice makes perfect :-).
Daily
4Hr
"Fall in love with the process and the results will follow" - Bradley Whitf
- #5,208
- Nov 27, 2017 4:14pm Nov 27, 2017 4:14pm
- | Joined Feb 2016 | Status: Be brave, be courageous, be prudent | 492 Posts
{quote} this does not make sens my only explanation is that it has been tested once: {image}
Just because you are at a DZ or SZ is not a guarantee for a successful trade. And yes, if your zone is not fresh chances are you may get a deeper penetration. Confirmation helps in some situations.
in the end it is not about the individual trade. Collectively your wins should be more than your losses and hence the RR of 3:1.
Hope this helps as it helps me with all my trade
Live life king size !
- #5,209
- Nov 27, 2017 5:04pm Nov 27, 2017 5:04pm
{quote} Hello papabless Welcome to T.I.O.F Good to meet you To answer your questions as precisely as is humanly type-able
Thank you. Well explained.
I was reading through the thread today, and I've also seen a picture of yours from like the 30th page where you refer to a zone, which did not accomplish anything, as just a selling zone that is not to be ignored.
2.
Understood.
I personally would be scared of the orders left in there so I'd either not trade it at all or exited before the zone because I do not posses the experience you do so I'd play it safe. Hopefully, with time, I too will be able to tell when I can 'ignore' a zone.
3.
You haven't finished your thought btw, you stopped in the middle of your sentence. How did that happen?
Here's a random chart example:
'A' removed 'B'
'B' removed 'C'
'C' does not have to remove anything. That's how I understand it so far.
a) Does it all end with 'C' which doesn't have to accomplish anything?
b) Still curious as to why do we even need zones to accomplish anything at all? I've never seen anybody with this rule.
How Can Mirrors Be Real If Our Eyes Aren't Real - Jaden Smith
- #5,210
- Nov 27, 2017 7:15pm Nov 27, 2017 7:15pm
- | Commercial User | Joined Jan 2016 | 2,682 Posts
{quote} 1. Thank you. Well explained. I was reading through the thread today, and I've also seen a picture of yours from like the 30th page where you refer to a zone, which did not accomplish anything, as just a selling zone that is not to be ignored. 2. Understood. I personally would be scared of the orders left in there so I'd either not trade it at all or exited before the zone because I do not posses the experience you do so I'd play it safe. Hopefully, with time, I too will be able to tell when I can 'ignore' a zone. 3. You haven't finished...
Apologies for the incomplete sentence. Fingers typing too long i guess
The sentence was meant to end with zone 3.
I have met several traders who use the accomplishment rule, too many to count.
Not everyone uses it though, and rightly so. The reason for not using it centers around what constitutes a zone, as in why is a zone a zone?
The fact that it removes an opposing level is important for sure, as has been mentioned on the thread many times already. Each S.A.D trader has the flexibility within the methodology to use or discard a given rule, as long as he or she has an indepth understanding of why and the concept behind the rule they are discarding.
One reason why it is important when a zone removes an opposing zone is that it shows the strength of the conviction of orders at a zone
By the way, "C" did remove something and it doesn't stop at C. When you read the thread, you will find pictures of charts where it is shown how zones are linked to each other, starting from the right side of the chart and working left.
best wishes
Be careful what you think because your thoughts run your life..Solomon
- #5,211
- Nov 27, 2017 7:22pm Nov 27, 2017 7:22pm
- | Commercial User | Joined Jan 2016 | 2,682 Posts
Be careful what you think because your thoughts run your life..Solomon
- #5,212
- Nov 27, 2017 7:48pm Nov 27, 2017 7:48pm
- | Commercial User | Joined Jan 2016 | 2,682 Posts
{quote} this does not make sens my only explanation is that it has been tested once: {image}
Welcome to T.I.O.F
Good to meet you
if i may, there is never any way of knowing for sure why a zone did not work. Us asking that question suggests an assumption on our part that we have access to the thoughts and perceptions of other market participants who traded price right through a level we thought was going to work.
The best that we can do in our reviews is to return to the rules we have regarding any methodology we have and to log instances when after following all those rules, things don't work out. That would provide a wealth of information for the trader intent on improving their skill set.
I have some thoughts i would like to share with you about the levels in the picture.
best wishes
Be careful what you think because your thoughts run your life..Solomon
- #5,213
- Nov 27, 2017 9:50pm Nov 27, 2017 9:50pm
- | Commercial User | Joined Jan 2016 | 2,682 Posts
Hello everyone
An old picture but a timeless reminder
best wishes 
An old picture but a timeless reminder
best wishes
Be careful what you think because your thoughts run your life..Solomon
- #5,217
- Nov 28, 2017 10:18am Nov 28, 2017 10:18am
{quote} Hello Papabless. Apologies for the incomplete sentence. Fingers typing too long i guess
So, say that the little zone I've overlooked, the one removed by 'C', does not exist.
Now,
i) 'A' is valid because it removed 'B'
ii) 'B' is also valid because it removed 'C', even though the 'C' did not remove anything.
iii) 'C' is then not valid because it did not remove anything. Not to be ignored, still a selling zone.
Are the statements correct?
Edit: I removed another zone from the picture, so 'B' removes only 'C'.
How Can Mirrors Be Real If Our Eyes Aren't Real - Jaden Smith
- #5,219
- Edited 2:15pm Nov 28, 2017 1:29pm | Edited 2:15pm
{quote} Copy pasted from Akt’s reply. By the way, "C" did remove something and it doesn't stop at C. When you read the thread, you will find pictures of charts where it is shown how zones are linked to each other, starting from the right side of the chart and working left.
What's your point? I believe I'm aware of everything within that sentence.
I now know that 'C' removed another zone, that's why the pretzel's there.
I also know that it does not stop at 'C', I just stopped there because I haven't seen the zone covered by the pretzel.
I did go from right to left.
Currently reading the thread (page #40), I'm just not sure if I understand it correctly, that's why I'm asking the questions.
How Can Mirrors Be Real If Our Eyes Aren't Real - Jaden Smith
- #5,220
- Nov 28, 2017 2:32pm Nov 28, 2017 2:32pm
- | Joined Feb 2016 | Status: Be brave, be courageous, be prudent | 492 Posts
{quote} Hi! What's your point? I believe I'm aware of everything within that sentence. I now know that 'C' removed another zone, that's why the pretzel's there. I also know that it does not stop at 'C', I just stopped there because I haven't seen the zone covered by the pretzel. I did go from right to left. Currently reading the thread (page #40), I'm just not sure if I understand it correctly, that's why I'm asking the questions.
i thought you missed that point from your response.
Live life king size !