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What would you do if you had to start over?

  • #21
  • Nov 25, 2017 2:44am Nov 25, 2017 2:44am
Quoting Rennaissance
{quote} The process I meant is too hard so most will quit before they figure it out.
yeah there is pain involved in everyone's career, but we are talking about losing 30k..

I mean if you're rich I guess that would be fine, but it seems that most people lose way more than the needed to learn. these people aren't going to succeed IMO.
  • #22
  • Edited 7:48am Nov 25, 2017 2:51am | Edited 7:48am
Quoting newbietofx
I just came across this on my Facebook feed. I started in post dotcom bubble. 10 years later. I've spent $30k and nothing to show for. But I've accumulated a library of resources, knowledge and experience. I'm thinking if I should move on. What about you. What have you accomplished? What will you tell your younger self? {image}
In your spare time while you hold your existing job that offers a steady income......

Learn everything you can in a live casino environment to gain an appreciation of the wide distribution of returns delivered by luck alone.

Start looking at what varying position sizes do to these distribution of returns and gain an appreciation of what risk of ruin is.

Learn how to stay at the table for extended periods in games that have a house edge through the application of risk management principles.

Now that you have this under your belt...... learn how to card count and deploy that $2000 in a live casino after you think you can calculate an edge. If you survive long enough you will start to appreciate that with the wide disparity of returns delivered by luck alone it is exceedingly difficult to actually define what you might think is an edge.

Now that you have had a bit of sense shaken into you....take whatever money you have left over and invest that money in some quality education understanding how the fund management industry operates and the techniques they use to set themselves apart from the retail trader.

....start to apply this information you have learnt with spare money that you can afford to lose from your primary income source. Keep your day job until your cashflows from trading exceed your primary source of income.......

....then you might be ready to take the market seriously.
  • #23
  • Nov 25, 2017 3:01am Nov 25, 2017 3:01am
Quoting newbietofx
I just came across this on my Facebook feed. I started in post dotcom bubble. 10 years later. I've spent $30k and nothing to show for. But I've accumulated a library of resources, knowledge and experience. I'm thinking if I should move on. What about you. What have you accomplished? What will you tell your younger self? {image}
If i have to start over, i will not put all eggs in one basket. Divide it, see the difference .
  • #24
  • Nov 25, 2017 3:38am Nov 25, 2017 3:38am
I would focus heavily on trading rules and applying patience and discipline from day one.

If you've been trigger happy on a demo account when you've been practising methods, it is very difficult to unwind that when you put real money in...
  • #25
  • Nov 25, 2017 3:39am Nov 25, 2017 3:39am
Quoting Rennaissance
The funny thing is how easy successful trading is, yet many fail to grasp it.
Can you explain me, please.
Thank you.
POW!
  • #26
  • Nov 25, 2017 3:45am Nov 25, 2017 3:45am
Quoting Piquant
{quote} I wouldn't wish to repeat what I went through the past 4 years...
Yes, I agree with your points. It is invaluable experience to first learn what does not work..
  • #27
  • Nov 25, 2017 5:04am Nov 25, 2017 5:04am
Quoting newbietofx
I just came across this on my Facebook feed. I started in post dotcom bubble. 10 years later. I've spent $30k and nothing to show for. But I've accumulated a library of resources, knowledge and experience. I'm thinking if I should move on. What about you. What have you accomplished? What will you tell your younger self? {image}
ditto Copernicus. just do what he says

Quoting Copernicus
{quote} In your spare time while you hold your existing job that offers a steady income...... Learn everything you can in a live casino environment to gain an appreciation of the wide distribution of returns delivered by luck alone. Start looking at what varying position sizes do to these distribution of returns and gain an appreciation of what risk of ruin is. Learn how to stay at the table for extended periods in games that have a house edge through the application of risk management principles. Now that you have this under your belt...... learn...
WaBaS Where are Buyers and Sellers
  • #28
  • Nov 25, 2017 5:30am Nov 25, 2017 5:30am
Quoting newbietofx
... What will you tell your younger self?...
capital matters only if supported by knowledge....If not, you know what happens.
NO MATTER THE SITUATION,NEVER LET YOUR EMOTIONS OVERPOWER YOUR INTELLIGENCE
  • #29
  • Nov 25, 2017 6:06am Nov 25, 2017 6:06am
I would tell myself to note that every time you think you need another 6 months to master your current workings/project/system or method, increase that time prediction by a factor of at least 4 (and then you need to repeat that for the next direction you will find yourself taking). Rinse, repeat.

I agree with many on here that 10+ years seems to be the norm, unless mentored early on. I lost many multiples of the OP's mentioned figure in my earlier years. Would i go through it all again? Well, of course, i would love to know what i know now and have my original pot, but there lies the conundrum doesn't it?!

It is all meant to be. The agony, the hurt, the pain of losing. Again and again. Like trying to go 20 rounds with Mike Tyson (in his prime). Get knocked down, get up again. It will take you to your limit time and time over.

My nephew asked me recently about getting into the world of trading and i told him not to bother unless he is willing to dedicate a decent chunk of his life, studying and suffering, risking developing all manner of stress related disorders, relationship problems, health issues etc

The reward is, as it has always been, get through it all and a very rewarding lifestyle awaits you. You will basically divide your life into two parts.

I wouldn't change a thing!)
GoFundMe -stage-4-glioma-brain-cancer-fighter (link in my profile)
  • #30
  • Nov 25, 2017 6:13am Nov 25, 2017 6:13am
This is a nice question.

I think the answer is quite simple: i'd say to my younger self to stick to easy concepts and rules, to not spend hours and hours studying indicators, strategies and stuff, but just to work on psychology and simple Price Action rules. I'd suggest him to study money management strategies, especially about martingale and anti-martingale differences, and to take care of his emotional state because that's where profit born and die.

I'd say a few, simple but effective things, as well as most of profitable traders would.

But I also know that "he" would never listen to me. He'd just continue on his way, 'cause i don't like to take other people's opinions for granted, not even mine . I like to test my ideas and eventually work on mistakes to find the right path.

So, in the end, maybe i would just give him a couple of books: trading in the zone, by Mark Douglas, and the money management one, by Andrea Unger.
It's not over, until I win.
  • #31
  • Nov 25, 2017 6:49am Nov 25, 2017 6:49am
Quoting fxprimate
{quote} Can you explain me, please. Thank you.
Well successful traders take money from the market effortlessly. There is no strain involved, it's like breathing. Do you even feel when you breath? No it's that effortless. These guys are killing machines I promise you. You pick up a fight against them they will rip your face off.
When you see it, BET big.
  • #32
  • Edited 7:53am Nov 25, 2017 7:14am | Edited 7:53am
I would have placed it al on red number 23.

Rien ne vas plus!

Ok now serious. I try to approach this as a hobby, begin with small amounts.
I would take two trades a week, and risk a microlot on every trade, I would move my stop loss to breakeven quickly and focus on not losing to much money.

Then I would learn how to close my trades according to my plan. I wouldn't change my plan because other peoples opnion, but I would take some peoples into account.

Like said earlier, I would make a hobby of predicting the market, and don't think I would get rich trough this game.

I would start a complex trading journal with a probability calculation depending on my previous results and market conditions. I would review every trade I made and then tweak my strategy to a point where I would win 50% of my trades for a longer period of time before I would think about raising the lotsizes.

Also, I wouldn't risk all my money in the forex or futures market and invest in stocks too.

I would trade WITH the intermediate trend but try to catch swings and obvious as it is only trade in trending markets.
I would invest most of my time not trading but keeping my journal and focussing on one chart.

Actually that's what I am doing now,

Approach it like a hobby, keep working hard, enjoy doing it, think positive and believe it is possible.

I wouldn't try to scalp, but focus on swing trading. I would focus on ONE market to start and I would only enter my orders in the evening or at noon or whenever the market I trade is calmest. (GMT +1)

I would make my plan by the end of the week and adjust it through the week if it's necessary.

And I wouldn't even start before reading this books:

- Trading in the zone (Mark Douglas)
- Technical Analysis of the FInancial Markets (John J. Murphy)
- Japanes Candlestick Charting Techniques (Steve Nison)
- Trade your way to financial freedom (Van K. Tharp)
- Elliot Wave Techniques Simplified (Bennet A Mcdowwel)
- Price action breakdown (Laurentiu Damir)
- Naked forex (Alex Nekritin)

Oh and a few other swing trade strategy books.

Keeping a positive mindset is most important, if you believe you will win, you will eventually. If you start believing it's impossible.... IT IS.

Maybe the most important thing. Make a strategy that is workable for you, maybe you have day jobs, children and wives etc.
AND STICK TO THAT STRATEGY, don't change it because it isn't profitable. It's not the strategy that's losing money, IT's you.
If you enter a trade don't stare at it, let it run and manage it two times a day. Never place stop losses too close to avoid stop hunting

When in doubt.. STOP, don't trade and go have a beer. Maybe next week? I don't wan't to risk my money and lose it.

Oh almost forgot, don't think money is that important, for me it isn't. But it's a fun hobby!
What's that smell? ---- I smell money!
  • #33
  • Nov 25, 2017 7:41am Nov 25, 2017 7:41am
Looking back I would say I did the right things 90% of the time in my journey, so mainly I would say "just do the same thing again as you did".

For the last 10% I would say (this could have shortened my journey about 3-4-5, maybe 6 months), that "don't come to this forum looking for the 'little extra edge', you have all the material you need to study. Just go with that, and don't try to modify it, or add to it according these guys' ideas".

This might sound a bit bitter, but there were some people here who acted really confident they have some extra to offer, but it turned out they are just full of shit. Like absolutely, completely full of it. I won't name them, because that would be the most asshole thing to do, but now it is fully obvious for me, that they are fully bullshitting about their image as a 'trader'.

Sorry about the negativity, but I feel resentment towards them.
Price and volume reveals everything. The market moves on supply and demand.
  • #34
  • Nov 25, 2017 8:16am Nov 25, 2017 8:16am
Quoting Rennaissance
{quote} Well successful traders take money from the market effortlessly. There is no strain involved, it's like breathing. Do you even feel when you breath? No it's that effortless. These guys are killing machines I promise you. You pick up a fight against them they will rip your face off.
I understand all of that ...

What I want you to explain me is this, please.
Quoting Rennaissance
The funny thing is how easy successful trading is, yet many fail to grasp it.
POW!
  • #35
  • Nov 25, 2017 8:35am Nov 25, 2017 8:35am
Quoting dkrock
{quote} Have you heard anyone say to make Forex like a business? If you do it literally, then you would have a profit/loss line, cost analysis of all your operations, and analysts compiling all your profits and expenditures so you can effectively control costs and charge enough for your product to continue to operate. If you literally treat Forex like it is a business, and Buy when price crosses above your profit/loss line, and Sell when it crosses below it, then you have a chance to make profit. Connecting the dots of historical trades has nothing...
Thanks for share your opinion, Dkrock, I understand all of that.

For us retail forex traders (we are the last link in the chain.) is not easy, on the contrary.
Maybe Rennaissance wanted to say simple instead of easy, for me there´s a huge difference.

That's why I insisted on asking again.
POW!
  • #36
  • Nov 25, 2017 9:27am Nov 25, 2017 9:27am
Quoting HeyYou
{quote} jesus christ... 30k ? well I would do the same thing but with less money... rinse and repeat
Unfortunately there are people who spend even more. I have seen it happen.
  • #37
  • Nov 25, 2017 9:47am Nov 25, 2017 9:47am
The problem with this business is that 99% of all the educational material out there is garbage and a fraud ! But when your starting out you cannot tell the difference. Unlike most other professions where there is a clear educational path. You have to start with the fact that to make a living at trading it will take YEARS of hard work no matter who you are ! NOBODY learns how to make a living in few months ! Simple systems...with simple rules...that you can learn quickly......that you can make a living with are a fantasy ! If it was true everybody would be doing it. For me the turning point came many years ago when I bought "Al Brooks" books and videos, I don't do much in forex....I day trade Nasdaq futures full time.
  • #38
  • Edited 11:53am Nov 25, 2017 10:48am | Edited 11:53am
Quoting mlawson71
{quote} Unfortunately there are people who spend even more. I have seen it happen.
I read somewhere that the average STOCK trader loses around $15k.

a bit of consolation sometimes isn't bad.
  • #39
  • Nov 25, 2017 10:55am Nov 25, 2017 10:55am
Not only for myself but every single person as well. Trade on a Demo account for a lot longer. On Demo I got a little successful trading and was making more money going for trades holding for weeks trying to catch the full length of a trend until it ends. But when I switched to a live account I would get nervous that I was wrong and price would come back against me when a trend retraced some and would close out a winning trade way early. I guess psychologically I wasn't prepared since Demo there is no worry of losing anything.
  • #40
  • Nov 25, 2017 11:37am Nov 25, 2017 11:37am
Quoting fxprimate
{quote} I understand all of that ... What I want you to explain me is this, please. {quote}
You take a position and ;
If it goes against you, exit.
If it goes for you you keep it until you believe the move is over.
When you see it, BET big.
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