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  • #1,001
  • Sep 20, 2006 7:53pm Sep 20, 2006 7:53pm
I don't know if anyone else has run into this.. I imagine you have since there are quite a few folks using IBFX with firebird v1.0c. Here's my issue.

I just installed MT4 from IBFX last night and loaded v1.0c EA using a mini account. What happened was it started opening trades at the micro amount (.10 cents a pip vs $1 a pip)

I deleted that account and created a new account using a standard account type with 1:200 leverage. When the EA ran, it created .1 lot sizes and p/l was $1 per pip, but the margin was $100 per lot size. So I lost my 1:200 leverage.

I then tried going back to a mini account using 1.0 as the lot size which created a margin used of $50 per lot size and $1 per pip. But the EA is coded to use .10 so the ea didn't work. I tried changing the lot size in the ea to 1.0 but it still didn't work.

How do I make this work correctly?
  • #1,002
  • Sep 20, 2006 10:10pm Sep 20, 2006 10:10pm
Quoting traderone
None of them will open countless trades really.

But I am live on v1.0a.

Settings are USDCHF 25-300-25
EURUSD 22-300-25
USDJPY 22-300-25
USDCAD 22-300-25

So far so good. Percent is .1
Divergence =true

I am running on M5 charts. I think that could be very important.
Thank you, Traderone. I'll try this one. But I remember that many people run it on M1 charts. Does it make any difference?
Another question, what is suggested minimum deposit? Is 3000 is ok? Do I have to change settings according to my deposit size?
  • #1,003
  • Sep 20, 2006 10:19pm Sep 20, 2006 10:19pm

Thoughts & Questions on Firebird<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o></o>


<o></o>

The weeks of Sept 5-15<SUP>th</SUP> have been heartburn weeks for me. Out of my three accounts running Firebird, of course, my live account was the one that took the losses, first two stop losses in GBP, and then I had to manually stop out due to approaching margin call. The first demo account running FB63H2-3, which was started a week earlier and with more funds ($5,000) then my live account (~$3000) had sufficient equity but had floats approaching 50% of equity but survived without any losses and to go on to profit. The 2<SUP>nd</SUP> demo account running FB 1.0b2 was funded with $10,000 and it also approached floats approaching 50% of equity. Unfortunately, my timing was lousy in my live account (running mostly FB63H02-H3, but switched briefly to FB 1.0b2 during the steep trending of the Euro. I had doubled the lot size on the four major pairs I was trading the week before the downtrend in the Euro. This put too much risk into this account resulting in my closing trades when margin calls began to threaten. One thing this did do was to underscore the importance of money management! Instead of sulking too much and becoming depressed I decided to take a look and ask questions and see what I could do to improve the outcome of the EA. I first looked at how the EA works as described in the script noted below:<o></o>

<o></o>
Firebird calculates a 10 day SMA and then shifts it up and down 2% to for a channel. For the calculation of this SMA either close (more trades) or H+L (safer trades) is used.When the price breaks a band a postion in the opposite of the current trend is taken. If the position goes against us we simply open an extra position to average.<o></o>

50% of the trades last a day. 45% 2-6 days 5% longer or just fail.<o></o>

<o></o>

<o></o>

1) Why a 10 day SMA? Why not 15 or 20, etc? What is the advantage of a 10 day SMA?<o></o>

2) Why not automatically close out trades held > 5 days; this would guarantee that most (90-95%) would close in profit, keeping down the float. Those closed out for a loss would be “the cost of doing business” and protect margin.<o></o>

3) In a trending market the V1.0b2, would seem to be more profitable because if the pair trends heavily, the trending side will go to profit while the hedged side will continue to move further away from profit. In a trending market, (how do we determine trending?...maybe by the number of candles in one direction?) the counter-trade should be hedged by less (rather than by an equal amount of the initiated trade.) The hedged part of the trade which should be determined by placing a pending order, should be triggered after the candle closes and determined by the direction or trend of the previous x number of candles. By reducing the amount of the hedge, say by 50%, we have a greater chance of it hitting the profit target. We know that in trending markets the retracements are less than in ranging markets. By limiting the number of days in the market and the amount of the hedge we increase the probability that our target will be hit. The way you could set the hedge percentage amount would be to wait until the initiating candle(s) was formed and then set the hedge amount by a percentage, determined by the strength of the trend…25%, 33%, 50%, 75%, etc., or as has been mentioned in a couple of posts, by fib levels, ie. 23%, 38%, 50%, 68%, 85%... <o></o>

4) If the float is controlled by #3, margin calls are not so much of a problem. <o></o>

5) How does MA Time Frame affect the EA?<o></o>

6) It is absolutely imperative to control the number of open orders. By closing out orders that have not matured in 5 days and/or have gone in the wrong direction by 50% or X% of the stop loss, this allows more profitable trades to be opened up. Trader Seven talks about this in one or two of his posts.<o></o>

7) It is imperative to have money management set up. Human nature is to be greedy, impulsive, etc. A mechanical system based on a set percentage of risk…and I mean total risk…not necessarly risk on each trade is absolutely necessary to survive. If margin approaches a certain percentage, then the EA needs to start closing out the least profitable trades to protect equity! (based on #6.) <o></o>

8) A note about Firebird v. 1.0b2.; the hedging version. When a position goes against you it initiates the pipstep function. Does it enter both a short and a long? Wouldn’t it be preferable to only enter one position, not both positions? If it does enter both positions, this only maximizes possible losses in the wrong direction. It does, however, provide for a profitable trade if the trend continues. Does the pipstep continue to run indefinitely if the position goes against you as more entries are made? If it does, maybe there should be a limit to the number of pipsteps.<o></o>

<o></o>

<o></o>
In looking at my two demo accounts the results are as follows (no losing trades):<o></o>

<o></o>

Version Days Traded Date Total PIPS-PIPs/Day Flt/Eq <o></o>

FB 63H02-03 25 8/14-9/18 4787/191 -3232/+9742 <o></o>
$5000<o></o>

18 Open trades; oldest 9/4; 7>5days<o></o>

<o></o>

FB 1.0b2 19 8/22-9/18 2989/157 -3323/+18010<o></o>
$10,000<o></o>

16 Open trades; oldest 9/1; 7>5 days<o></o>

<o></o>

Conclusions: <o></o>

<o></o>

FB 63H02 gains more PIPS/day but carries twice the float. <o></o>

<o></o>

Comments or thoughts?<o></o>

<o></o>

1Trader2<o></o>
  • #1,004
  • Sep 20, 2006 10:35pm Sep 20, 2006 10:35pm
Quoting txsundevil
Traderone:

Are you getting pretty negative returns this week in USD/CAD on the 5 minute. Others are great but down on 0.10 lots over $128 currently on open float, very small amout booked profits on USD/CAD
Yeah. USDCAD has been disappointing this week. But the USDJPY has been good.
Don Life is expensive, but includes a free trip around the sun.
  • #1,005
  • Sep 20, 2006 10:42pm Sep 20, 2006 10:42pm
Quoting wackena
coolhand,

I added the trailing stop to FB to maximize profits out of trends. For example: t/s=30 is near equivalent to t/p=25. If EA only has t/p, it exits orders at this profit level. But with using t/s, the EA treats t/s as first takeprofit level and if trend continues, additional pips can be made. Using t/s with FB takes nothing away from EA performance, it just increases chance to make additional pips.

Note: As discussed earlier with swissly, If using FBv63g-TS, set t/p above t/s. I suggest setting t/p above expected trends. I use t/p=50. I think setting at 100-150 is a good idea and could allow major pip gains from long reverse trends.

2nd note: For recently started FB EA and how FB handles news events or long trend spikes is determine a lot by when EA was started. Over last 6 weeks, several times I have started same EA on separate Demos, with identical settings, on different days. The results on news event days and strong trends were almost 180 degrees different. For example, one will have sell loses and the other demo will make profits from buys. The longer the Demos run, this effect equalizes out and both perform nearly the same. So judging this EA badly because of short term loses, is not a true evaluation. For me, I critique this EA like I critique my 401K. It is the long haul gains that I want. The last few years, my 401K has seen equity loses of 15-20% during each year. But overall it has gains from year to year. If I can get similar results with FB, I will be happy. Sorry, I'm long winded today.

Wackena

Wackena
Wackena,

When you use the trailing stop do you set both the TP and the TS parameters, or just the TS? Say for instance that you want to set a TS for 30, insuring that you gain a minimum of 30 pips. Do you set the TP @ 0 or do you also set it @ 30, or above or below it? This has always confused me! Also, if I want to add a TS function to a Firebird EA that doesn't have one, can you copy and pastes this from another version and does it have to occur in a certain part of the program? Any help you can give is appreciated for us non-programmers. (I did go out and get a book on C++ today, so my education is starting!!)
  • #1,006
  • Sep 21, 2006 12:30am Sep 21, 2006 12:30am
1trader2,

The first thing is NOT to trade Cable with any FB....

Just my thoughts having seen some of the losses caused by that pair.
  • #1,007
  • Sep 21, 2006 1:24am Sep 21, 2006 1:24am
I have been trading firebird v1.0c using the M5 tf trading EURUSD, AUDUSD, USDCAD, and USDCHF and have had very good results. broker is FXDD. The first week I used the M1 charts and took some losses.

I'll attach my statement. The one thing to pay close attention to is starting on 9/13 my account balance was about 221. Down from the original 500. Since 9/13, there were only 2 losses. Basically, I gone from about 221 to 954 since the 13th.

Quoting 1trader2

Thoughts & Questions on Firebird<o></o>


<o></o>

The weeks of Sept 5-15<sup>th</sup> have been heartburn weeks for me. Out of my three accounts running Firebird, of course, my live account was the one that took the losses, first two stop losses in GBP, and then I had to manually stop out due to approaching margin call. The first demo account running FB63H2-3, which was started a week earlier and with more funds ($5,000) then my live account (~$3000) had sufficient equity but had floats approaching 50% of equity but survived without any losses and to go on to profit. The 2<sup>nd</sup> demo account running FB 1.0b2 was funded with $10,000 and it also approached floats approaching 50% of equity. Unfortunately, my timing was lousy in my live account (running mostly FB63H02-H3, but switched briefly to FB 1.0b2 during the steep trending of the Euro. I had doubled the lot size on the four major pairs I was trading the week before the downtrend in the Euro. This put too much risk into this account resulting in my closing trades when margin calls began to threaten. One thing this did do was to underscore the importance of money management! Instead of sulking too much and becoming depressed I decided to take a look and ask questions and see what I could do to improve the outcome of the EA. I first looked at how the EA works as described in the script noted below:<o></o>

<o></o>
Firebird calculates a 10 day SMA and then shifts it up and down 2% to for a channel. For the calculation of this SMA either close (more trades) or H+L (safer trades) is used.When the price breaks a band a postion in the opposite of the current trend is taken. If the position goes against us we simply open an extra position to average.<o></o>

50% of the trades last a day. 45% 2-6 days 5% longer or just fail.<o></o>

<o></o>

<o></o>

1) Why a 10 day SMA? Why not 15 or 20, etc? What is the advantage of a 10 day SMA?<o></o>

2) Why not automatically close out trades held > 5 days; this would guarantee that most (90-95%) would close in profit, keeping down the float. Those closed out for a loss would be “the cost of doing business” and protect margin.<o></o>

3) In a trending market the V1.0b2, would seem to be more profitable because if the pair trends heavily, the trending side will go to profit while the hedged side will continue to move further away from profit. In a trending market, (how do we determine trending?...maybe by the number of candles in one direction?) the counter-trade should be hedged by less (rather than by an equal amount of the initiated trade.) The hedged part of the trade which should be determined by placing a pending order, should be triggered after the candle closes and determined by the direction or trend of the previous x number of candles. By reducing the amount of the hedge, say by 50%, we have a greater chance of it hitting the profit target. We know that in trending markets the retracements are less than in ranging markets. By limiting the number of days in the market and the amount of the hedge we increase the probability that our target will be hit. The way you could set the hedge percentage amount would be to wait until the initiating candle(s) was formed and then set the hedge amount by a percentage, determined by the strength of the trend…25%, 33%, 50%, 75%, etc., or as has been mentioned in a couple of posts, by fib levels, ie. 23%, 38%, 50%, 68%, 85%... <o></o>

4) If the float is controlled by #3, margin calls are not so much of a problem. <o></o>

5) How does MA Time Frame affect the EA?<o></o>

6) It is absolutely imperative to control the number of open orders. By closing out orders that have not matured in 5 days and/or have gone in the wrong direction by 50% or X% of the stop loss, this allows more profitable trades to be opened up. Trader Seven talks about this in one or two of his posts.<o></o>

7) It is imperative to have money management set up. Human nature is to be greedy, impulsive, etc. A mechanical system based on a set percentage of risk…and I mean total risk…not necessarly risk on each trade is absolutely necessary to survive. If margin approaches a certain percentage, then the EA needs to start closing out the least profitable trades to protect equity! (based on #6.) <o></o>

8) A note about Firebird v. 1.0b2.; the hedging version. When a position goes against you it initiates the pipstep function. Does it enter both a short and a long? Wouldn’t it be preferable to only enter one position, not both positions? If it does enter both positions, this only maximizes possible losses in the wrong direction. It does, however, provide for a profitable trade if the trend continues. Does the pipstep continue to run indefinitely if the position goes against you as more entries are made? If it does, maybe there should be a limit to the number of pipsteps.<o></o>

<o></o>

<o></o>
In looking at my two demo accounts the results are as follows (no losing trades):<o></o>

<o></o>

Version Days Traded Date Total PIPS-PIPs/Day Flt/Eq <o></o>

FB 63H02-03 25 8/14-9/18 4787/191 -3232/+9742 <o></o>
$5000<o></o>

18 Open trades; oldest 9/4; 7>5days<o></o>

<o></o>

FB 1.0b2 19 8/22-9/18 2989/157 -3323/+18010<o></o>
$10,000<o></o>

16 Open trades; oldest 9/1; 7>5 days<o></o>

<o></o>

Conclusions: <o></o>

<o></o>

FB 63H02 gains more PIPS/day but carries twice the float. <o></o>

<o></o>

Comments or thoughts?<o></o>

<o></o>

1Trader2<o></o>
Attached File(s)
File Type: zip Statement.zip   6 KB | 436 downloads
  • #1,008
  • Sep 21, 2006 5:15am Sep 21, 2006 5:15am
What settings did you use Scott?




Quoting dscott5912
I have been trading firebird v1.0c using the M5 tf trading EURUSD, AUDUSD, USDCAD, and USDCHF and have had very good results. broker is FXDD. The first week I used the M1 charts and took some losses.

I'll attach my statement. The one thing to pay close attention to is starting on 9/13 my account balance was about 221. Down from the original 500. Since 9/13, there were only 2 losses. Basically, I gone from about 221 to 954 since the 13th.
  • #1,009
  • Sep 21, 2006 5:22am Sep 21, 2006 5:22am
tradeforone, I am to running version 1.0a on a 5k demo account with three pairs with great results.

It's time to open a live account with Interbank which offers micro accounts.

Going to start with $300 which would require a micro account to run three pairs. What variable settings do I need to change?

Thanks.


Quoting traderone
I am running on v1.0a. started with a mini of $2200. Running the four pair at .5 mini lots. (Around 50 cents per lot EurUSD). My settings are conservative, not like v1.0c.
  • #1,010
  • Sep 21, 2006 7:07am Sep 21, 2006 7:07am
Quoting cgldsmth
lots of trades - what were yur settings, in particular, percent?
I used the default settings ... didn't modify a single value.

I ran it on all of the pairs listed with my broker for the M1 charts.

For the M5 I took more of the majors (8 pairs as can be seen in the statement).

I would caution anybody against trading on these numbers on live. Please remeber that these were DEMO accounts, and there is anight and day difference in terms of how brokers treat demo accounts.

Personally I'd have to see a result of at least 100% return on a DEMO account over one month before plunging with REAL money, and then I'd be REALLY happy to see a 10% return in a given month. But that's my humble opinion only.
Just my 2 pips worth
  • #1,011
  • Sep 21, 2006 7:41am Sep 21, 2006 7:41am
Quoting 1trader2

Thoughts & Questions on Firebird<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o></o>



...

<o></o>
6) It is absolutely imperative to control the number of open orders. By closing out orders that have not matured in 5 days and/or have gone in the wrong direction by 50% or X% of the stop loss, this allows more profitable trades to be opened up. Trader Seven talks about this in one or two of his posts.<o></o>

1Trader2<o></o>
Great post!

This particular statement stood out to me because I think it is *very* important. My live account has been profitable all the way through this difficult time, and float has never exceeded about 25%. I think the key has been to control the number of open orders. Personally, I'm using the old V63G and I have no interest in an automated form of control in this area. I keep tabs on the number of simultaneous open orders, as well as market conditions, and maintain a number that (if they ALL stopped out) would still not result in a margin call. I believe this is key to the survivability of my trading account... a primary component of successful trading is to "live to fight another day".

This is also my personal opinion, but I think the best way to control the number of open orders is by stopping the EA and allowing existing orders to "flush out" over time. I've stated this many times, and continue to assert that manually closing trades is a bad idea 99% of the time. All the testing I have done indicates that arbitrarily closing all open trades once per week (like closing all orders on Friday), or even once per month, has a quite an adverse affect on profits. Obviously, controlling open orders might not get me the crazy profits we've been seeing in the 80% per month range, but 40% this month is quite acceptable. ;-)

I do have a few "deadbeat" trades hanging around from 2 weeks ago, but they are in the -180 pip range. Still a far cry from the -300 stoploss. In keeping with the way this system works, and my results from testing, I plan to leave those trades out there until they close themselves... even if swap eats up the profits.
  • #1,012
  • Sep 21, 2006 9:55am Sep 21, 2006 9:55am
Berdj - the settings are automatically calcluated in v1.0c. See posting #1.

Quoting berdj
What settings did you use Scott?
  • #1,013
  • Sep 21, 2006 11:29am Sep 21, 2006 11:29am
hi all, i've been following the FF since 6 months ago..being a member about a week ago and my first post today.

question bout firebird 1.0c,

i've been using it on my demo account for about 3 days now..

default settings,

on my demo account running on mt4 NF platform its working but when i implement in on my live account its not workling... both running on the same settings only the different is demo have 50,000usd margin and live have 1K usd margin..now i opened 2 platform (1 on demo 1 on live acc) but only the on on demo is working. Why is that so...is there any settings that i need to tweak in order to make the EA working on live?

sorry for being noob on this stuff..but it makes me confius...

by the way, both is on 1:500 leverage and the lot settings is 0.1

btw i've manually change the settings on live account at the option > trade tab to default lot to 0.1 but it still doenst execute the orders while the demo is running perfectly...
  • #1,014
  • Sep 21, 2006 12:15pm Sep 21, 2006 12:15pm
Please - I would like to hear from anyone running firebird v1.0c (or the other 2) live with a mini InterBank account. I know folks are running it. I have yet to find a way to do this. Please PM me if you don't want to use forum space. My yahoo id is dscott5912.

I would really like to get a speedy resolution to this!

Quoting dscott5912
I don't know if anyone else has run into this.. I imagine you have since there are quite a few folks using IBFX with firebird v1.0c. Here's my issue.

I just installed MT4 from IBFX last night and loaded v1.0c EA using a mini account. What happened was it started opening trades at the micro amount (.10 cents a pip vs $1 a pip)

I deleted that account and created a new account using a standard account type with 1:200 leverage. When the EA ran, it created .1 lot sizes and p/l was $1 per pip, but the margin was $100 per lot size. So I lost my 1:200 leverage.

I then tried going back to a mini account using 1.0 as the lot size which created a margin used of $50 per lot size and $1 per pip. But the EA is coded to use .10 so the ea didn't work. I tried changing the lot size in the ea to 1.0 but it still didn't work.

How do I make this work correctly?
  • #1,015
  • Sep 21, 2006 12:17pm Sep 21, 2006 12:17pm
Quoting emptycube
hi all, i've been following the FF since 6 months ago..being a member about a week ago and my first post today.

question bout firebird 1.0c,

i've been using it on my demo account for about 3 days now..

default settings,

on my demo account running on mt4 NF platform its working but when i implement in on my live account its not workling... both running on the same settings only the different is demo have 50,000usd margin and live have 1K usd margin..now i opened 2 platform (1 on demo 1 on live acc) but only the on on demo is working. Why is that so...is there any settings that i need to tweak in order to make the EA working on live?

sorry for being noob on this stuff..but it makes me confius...

by the way, both is on 1:500 leverage and the lot settings is 0.1

btw i've manually change the settings on live account at the option > trade tab to default lot to 0.1 but it still doenst execute the orders while the demo is running perfectly...
Check your Live account Journal for errors.

Wackena
  • #1,016
  • Sep 21, 2006 12:20pm Sep 21, 2006 12:20pm
Quoting wackena
Check your Live account Journal for errors.

Wackena
hi wackena,

my journal says nuthing,

"Expert Advisor_v1.0c EURUSD, M1: loaded successfully" that's it

ehmm i've contacted my broker and they said it got nuthing to do with the platform on demo and live ..only the difference by the streaming by 1 pips difference if it do have a slight difference

so i was thinking is it because of the settings on the EA itself?
  • #1,017
  • Sep 21, 2006 12:26pm Sep 21, 2006 12:26pm
Quoting emptycube
hi wackena,

my journal says nuthing,

"Expert Advisor_v1.0c EURUSD, M1: loaded successfully" that's it

ehmm i've contacted my broker and they said it got nuthing to do with the platform on demo and live ..only the difference by the streaming by 1 pips difference if it do have a slight difference

so i was thinking is it because of the settings on the EA itself?
Does UseMM=true or false?

If false, try lot size of 0.01. This is just a test lot size. I wonder if the 1:500 would limit max lot size.

Wackena
  • #1,018
  • Sep 21, 2006 1:03pm Sep 21, 2006 1:03pm
Hi wackena, I'm jus trying to understand about what you said below.
The EA treats the trailing stop as a first takeprofit, does this mean that if trading mulitple lots it takes profit for first lot at 30 pips?
I'm just needing help understanding this, as I thought if you set a trailing stop for 30, then after 30 pips movement in your favour, it will start trailing, and say you got 30 pips in profit, normally firebird would close if that was your t/p, but if you have a 30 pip trailing stop, if got in 30 pips profit, and then market turned against us, wouldn't it not take profit where as if it was a straight 30 pip t/p it would have. Sorry about this, just trying to understand it.

If this is unclear i'll try again.
thanks
  • #1,019
  • Sep 21, 2006 1:12pm Sep 21, 2006 1:12pm
Quoting stricko108
Hi wackena, I'm jus trying to understand about what you said below.
The EA treats the trailing stop as a first takeprofit, does this mean that if trading mulitple lots it takes profit for first lot at 30 pips?
I'm just needing help understanding this, as I thought if you set a trailing stop for 30, then after 30 pips movement in your favour, it will start trailing, and say you got 30 pips in profit, normally firebird would close if that was your t/p, but if you have a 30 pip trailing stop, if got in 30 pips profit, and then market turned against us, wouldn't it not take profit where as if it was a straight 30 pip t/p it would have. Sorry about this, just trying to understand it.

If this is unclear i'll try again.
thanks
You are correct. I should have said it locks in a profit by trailing stop, rather than actually closing the order and taking a profit at that point.

Wackena
  • #1,020
  • Sep 21, 2006 1:24pm Sep 21, 2006 1:24pm
Quoting wackena
Does UseMM=true or false?

If false, try lot size of 0.01. This is just a test lot size. I wonder if the 1:500 would limit max lot size.

Wackena
hi wackena, currently the MM is set to false,
whats the diff when the money management set to true... any effect on the EA and the trade itself...hope u can enlighten me n this stuff
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