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The Trader's Academy - by Traders for Traders

  • #1,361
  • Jul 28, 2017 2:48am Jul 28, 2017 2:48am
I just read this article....

Fantastic....

http://www.tradingacademy.com/lesson...-your-trading/
  • #1,362
  • Jul 29, 2017 3:44am Jul 29, 2017 3:44am
We dont see things the way they are, we see them the way we are. Talmud


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Tharp
  • #1,363
  • Edited 11:15am Jul 29, 2017 7:09am | Edited 11:15am
Within months of viewing my very first financial chart ten years ago, I realized that far from being random, price moved in an often very orderly fashion between points of support and resistance. Even when the price movement was very messy, it nevertheless moved between points, even if it took longer to reach them on some days that it did on others.

In fact, once I understood that trading was not something I was going to be able to learn in a matter of months, which was my initial misconception, I set myself four key objectives, which were -

1/ To understand direction. Why did the price go up some days, down on others, or go nowhere in particular, ping ponging back and forth? How could I determine what the price was most likely to do on any given day? This for me was my most important initial focus of study.

2/ Where were the most likely areas of support and resistance, and why?

3/ Once the above had been achieved to a greater or lesser degree, how could I devise a method for obtaining an optimal entry point, with minimal risk and the greatest chance of not being stopped out?

4/ Connected to number two - how would I know where to take profit? This always was and still is the most difficult part of trading for me to master.

I worked on the above tirelessly in my spare time, not for months, but for years. I have written briefly in this thread about the many challenges there have been along this long, hard road, but amidst all the ups and downs, I never once doubted that trading was something I could do, and do successfully, even when others close to me did. This is the ultimate key to success, because above and beyond all the technical and psychological requirements for being a successful trader, it is something we have to want with every last fibre of our body and soul.

Although I now trade full time, I am still improving incrementally, learning from every single trade I take,
  • #1,364
  • Jul 29, 2017 9:26am Jul 29, 2017 9:26am
Cat described it nicely. For me, it's direction, momentum and s/r levels - It took years of chart time before they came together, levels is the most difficult. Still learning new things every single day.
  • #1,365
  • Jul 31, 2017 1:54am Jul 31, 2017 1:54am
Quoting cat
...I never once doubted that trading was something I could do, and do successfully, even when others close to me did. This is the ultimate key to success, because above and beyond all the technical and psychological requirements for being a successful trader, it is something we have to want with every last fibre of our body and soul...
Ab-so-lutely!

Double-plus-good!

This is something that I am currently working with in my world... I don't like to divulge account amounts, but people I try to share trading with, it seems that all they want to know. "Yeah, but how much is that in real money...?"

I say to them, "It's not the amount attached, it's the percentage..."

10% growth is 10% growth... It's very hard for other people to get excited about 10% growth on $100
But it becomes very exciting to other people when you have 10% growth on $1,000,000

I ask people if they would work 4-5 hours a day, 5 days a week, for a whole year for $100....
Most people just laugh...and say no... I then ask them if they would first pay that $100 and work the whole year... they laugh more...
No... people wouldn't...

But I then change their frame of reference and say, what about if you put $100 in the stock market (because most people don't know about Forex)
And you could grow that $100 into $200 by the end of the year...
But it would require that you study the market, 4-5 hours a day, 5 days a week, for a whole year...

Pensive nods follow... I say it's not about the dollar amount, it's the percentage...
  • #1,366
  • Jul 31, 2017 7:10am Jul 31, 2017 7:10am
Quoting cat
Within months of viewing my very first financial chart ten years ago, I realized that far from being random, price moved in an often very orderly fashion between points of support and resistance. Even when the price movement was very messy, it nevertheless moved between points, even if it took longer to reach them on some days that it did on others. In fact, once I understood that trading was not something I was going to be able to learn in a matter of months, which was my initial misconception, I set myself four key objectives, which were - 1/...
daaaa it took you 10 years? You have been lied/fooled for 10 years that the market is random.... This isn't science where everything happened (as they said) randomly/random occurrence.
This is not investment/trading advise. Will not hold accountable for loss
  • #1,367
  • Edited 8:48am Jul 31, 2017 7:45am | Edited 8:48am
Quoting nummularius
{quote} Ab-so-lutely! Double-plus-good! This is something that I am currently working with in my world... I don't like to divulge account amounts, but people I try to share trading with, it seems that all they want to know. "Yeah, but how much is that in real money...?" I say to them, "It's not the amount attached, it's the percentage..." 10% growth is 10% growth... It's very hard for other people to get excited about 10% growth on $100 But it becomes very exciting to other people when you have 10% growth on $1,000,000 I ask people if they would...
with a regular job you can make much more than $100 / year lol

suppose your investment is $1.000, at the end of the year you have $1.000

with a regular job you make $20.000/year

how many years will it take to make more than 20k in one year trading, assuming that you make 100% each year (which is unlikely IMO) ?

5 looong years... I hope you have a second job to pay the bills.

Just consider this, the higher the percentage at the end of year, the higher the luck involved.

nothing wrong with that..as long as you keep that in mind!
  • #1,368
  • Jul 31, 2017 9:55am Jul 31, 2017 9:55am
Quoting yousername
{quote} daaaa it took you 10 years? You have been lied/fooled for 10 years that the market is random.... This isn't science where everything happened (as they said) randomly/random occurrence.
You obviously misunderstood what I wrote. I suggest you read it again, carefully.
  • #1,369
  • Jul 31, 2017 10:02am Jul 31, 2017 10:02am
Quoting cat
{quote} You obviously misunderstood what I wrote. I suggest you read it again, carefully.
yes i red it.
i was just replying to specific part of your post... 10 years to realize the market behaviour
This is not investment/trading advise. Will not hold accountable for loss
  • #1,370
  • Jul 31, 2017 10:06am Jul 31, 2017 10:06am
I remember first time I learned trading. I got my information from babypips school.
https://www.babypips.com/learn/forex
Never crossed in my mind that the market moved randomly but in orderly fashion. That's why there's trend, patterns. Patterns don't appear in a random world.

This is not investment/trading advise. Will not hold accountable for loss
  • #1,371
  • Jul 31, 2017 10:09am Jul 31, 2017 10:09am
Quoting yousername
{quote} yes i red it. i was just replying to specific part of your post... 10 years to realize the market behaviour
Well you read it wrong. I understand that you are not a native English speaker, so here is what I wrote...

" Within months of viewing my very first financial chart ten years ago, I realized that far from being random, price moved in an often very orderly fashion...."

So I never said it took me ten years to do anything, I said it is ten years since I first looked at a financial chart.
  • #1,372
  • Jul 31, 2017 10:12am Jul 31, 2017 10:12am
Quoting cat
{quote} Well you read it wrong. I understand that you are not a native English speaker, so here is what I wrote... " Within months of viewing my very first financial chart ten years ago, I realized that far from being random, price moved in an often very orderly fashion...." So I never said it took me ten years to do anything, I said it is ten years since I first looked at a financial chart.
ok, I apologize for my misunderstanding
Need to go back to school learning English first
This is not investment/trading advise. Will not hold accountable for loss
  • #1,373
  • Jul 31, 2017 11:04am Jul 31, 2017 11:04am
Quoting yousername
{quote} ok, I apologize for my misunderstanding Need to go back to school learning English first
Not a problem!
  • #1,374
  • Jul 31, 2017 5:28pm Jul 31, 2017 5:28pm
very inspiring for stupid trader like me
  • #1,375
  • Aug 1, 2017 1:38am Aug 1, 2017 1:38am
Quoting Mr.yen
very inspiring for stupid trader like me
None of us are stupid, well, I guess some of us probably are, but all of us do stupid things, especially when trading, so as long as we do everything we can to minimize those stupid things, we all stand a great chance!
  • #1,376
  • Aug 1, 2017 2:05am Aug 1, 2017 2:05am
thankyou master Cat...
  • #1,377
  • Edited 10:07am Aug 2, 2017 9:34am | Edited 10:07am
A quick word about strategies, because there is a huge misconception that trading touts feed off and new traders get burned by.

A friend told me that a friend of his sells his strategy for $40 a week. This implies that the ability to trade consistently and successfully is something that can be purchased. If this was so, there would be many more successful traders out there than there are.

Anyone, and I mean anyone, selling a trading strategy, is a fraud. This is because even if such a thing as a winning strategy existed, which it doesn't, no trader would sell it, why would they? They are making money, good money, so why sell it?

It is not a strategy that takes money out of the markets, it is the trader who does. The trader uses the hard won knowledge and experience of the markets to devise a strategy that is symbiotic with the trader, and he/she can no more give it away that I can sell my own personality. This is why off the shelf trading systems for people who have not taken the time to study the markets for themselves are for dreamers and those who come into trading for a quick buck, and they will always result in lost money.

Could I sell the trading system I use? No way, because people would be asking for their money back within weeks. I understand my own system because it has evolved with me as I have studied and traded the markets over the years, but in someone else's hands, hoping to see what I see from day one, it would be completely confusing and useless. Yes, I dare say given time anyone would be able to piece it all together as I have done, but how long would that take? Far better to set out to devise one's own personal trading system than to try to adopt someone else's.

So those are my thoughts on this. Pay for any trading system, and try to earn money with it without putting in the requisite work required, and you are in for one hell of a disappointment. There are no systems, there are only individual traders whose own capabilities as traders are contingent with the time and effort they have invested into learning how to trade.

If there is anyone out there successfully using a strategy they have purchased, I'd love to hear from them.
  • #1,378
  • Aug 2, 2017 11:07am Aug 2, 2017 11:07am
IF there exist such a universal system that anyone can use it successfully, it has to be highly mechanical in nature with very little room for discretion, simple enough for the average joe trader to understand the concepts behind the system, and so convincing for him to have that faith to execute the trades. A huge IF.
  • #1,379
  • Aug 3, 2017 2:05am Aug 3, 2017 2:05am
Quoting cat
If this was so, there would be many more successful traders out there than there are.
I think the primary determining factor is discipline and not a winning strategy. This is such a clich thing to say but consider this:

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And the thing is this... It's true... I have given out my trading strategy (which totally works for me) to friends and family... I have sat with them for hours and coached them... And by the end, they want to change things, and make it their own. As soon as a strategy, system, or method gets in the hands of another trader it mutates.

Here's the most simple of approaches... At any time you wish, click buy or sell... Then cross your fingers... After one hour close the trade... Did you win?

Take even that most simple approach and someone will want to change it... They will want to wait just a bit shorter, or longer... Or open two trades simultaneously... Or any number of wild things... Perhaps they won't even follow the most simple of instructions of crossing their fingers... Maybe they don't see any value in it, or just want to make it their own...
  • #1,380
  • Aug 3, 2017 2:21am Aug 3, 2017 2:21am
Quoting nummularius
{quote} I think the primary determining factor is discipline and not a winning strategy. This is such a clich thing to say but consider this: {image} And the thing is this... It's true... I have given out my trading strategy (which totally works for me) to friends and family... I have sat with them for hours and coached them... And by the end, they want to change things, and make it their own. As soon as a strategy, system, or method gets in the hands of another trader it mutates. Here's the most simple of approaches... At any time you wish, click...
Yeah, as it has already been said in this thread: "It's an ego thing - nobody wants the simple solution that gets handed to them, everybody wants to be the genius that solves the unsolvable problem."
Invincibility lies in the defence; the possibility of victory in the attack
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