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Do you find it hard to stay motivated?

  • #21
  • Jul 11, 2017 6:51am Jul 11, 2017 6:51am
I have sacrificed everything to pursue full time trading as career. It's consumed my life. That's enough to keep me going. That includes my marriage, my job, my health, and sanity. Once you've given up all of that, there's really no turning back. If I could do it all over, I would have likely taken it slower and done it differently but it's too late now. It's profit or bust at that point as there's nothing to go back to. If that doesn't motivate, I don't know what else will...
  • #22
  • Jul 11, 2017 6:57am Jul 11, 2017 6:57am
Don't listen to people telling you you need to spend all your life screening the charts and if you are not profitable, that's because you are not trying hard enough and not burning your precious time enough...

They just want you to lose your life with this garbage just like they did...because they are still nor profitable after so many years lost trying to find the hidden secret of lazy life.

You see the image posted before in this thread? Chances are that you will be coming to the end but you will still be completely broke and old.

That is the truth, man and you'd better ask your real friends or family who care about you, instead of random losers here.They will all tell you that this is just gambling and you'd better enjoy your life and what you have now, because life is short and you are not eternal.

I know you will not like to hear that. So sorry for that.
Don't give up on your dreams. Keep sleeping.
  • #23
  • Jul 11, 2017 6:58am Jul 11, 2017 6:58am
Quoting skyway
Hi Piquant We talked a bit on that earlier cat's thread. I understand you and feel your plight. There's a lot of issues involved and I believe you're by now fully aware of each and every one of them which are tied together as one financial path you want to take by trading the financial markets on a full time basis instead of being employed with a company. 1. Let's start with the basic goal - trade a lot size of 1standard lot. 2. You need to risk a starting capital compatible to trade at this 1standard lot. 3. You need a strategy that has a confirmed...
Hey skyway!

well we meet again.
where do I even begin ?

I'm not offended in any way , in fact I do appreciate your thoughtful response.

When I deposited 200$ in my now 50$ account back in Feb I was beat up from my last string of failures but I worked up the courage to try it again once more. I was all around the place, one day I find myself trading GJ on minute chart to next day EURUSD on 1h to make matters worse I would take profit as soon as few dollars come in to my account or would close trades as it goes few pips against me explains why I had lost huge chunk of that initial capital. Then things started taking a turn when I moved up to trading 1h,4h,12h and daily charts (currently 12h). At this stage I reached a point of stability in a long struggle of down cycle. But can I say it out loud with confidence that I have an edge ? probably not. I guess this where I'm lost. And you're right about everything. As for which route to take, I'll have to give this one a good thought. Maybe I should top it up again with 200$ or 500$ and aim for a doable target.
...
  • #24
  • Jul 11, 2017 6:58am Jul 11, 2017 6:58am
Whatever they say whatever they want..keep mooving forward
  • #25
  • Jul 11, 2017 7:02am Jul 11, 2017 7:02am
Quoting Madinvestor
I have sacrificed everything to pursue full time trading as career. It's consumed my life. That's enough to keep me going. That includes my marriage, my job, my health, and sanity. Once you've given up all of that, there's really no turning back. If I could do it all over, I would have likely taken it slower and done it differently but it's too late now. It's profit or bust at that point as there's nothing to go back to. If that doesn't motivate, I don't know what else will...
Sorry to hear that, man. It's brave to share your story and to tell the truth. Stay strong and don't blame yourself. We all do mistakes.
Don't give up on your dreams. Keep sleeping.
  • #26
  • Jul 11, 2017 7:06am Jul 11, 2017 7:06am
Well, this might be a "just works for me" type of thing, but I personally use systems that only change OVERALL direction 1-4 times per trading month. Then I build into positions at "good prices" using statistics when I see pushes in a favorable direction to get VALUE (for long term LONG) or OVERPRICED (for long term SHORT). I usually then end up catching from 0.008 to 0.03 on the net position, honest truth.

I think everyone and their brother tries to scalp, uses stops too close, gets stops run (before it goes your way anyway), and ends up paying for broker's cars/boats/houses, etc. BOTH getting stops run rapidly against them and by overpaying in the BID-ASK spread as they hyper-actively enter and exit to "scalp."

I think most should open up to sticking to a trend on a longer timeframe, and after they did they would be more than consistently profitable in my opinion. I also WORK and position trade - I work in finance as a programmer - so I could just be special with my job... but you need like 10% of job cash to just throw into high risk stuff like this as your "own business." I think many get the impression that they can get to millions from a few hundred, but you are far more likely to get there or close by starting out saving like 10-20k for FX use... just my opinion though and I'm sure I'll be at odds with many.

And yes, my style can admittedly be demotivating because it involves a LOT of waiting for just a few times of ACTION/PANIC... but I'm not in it for action, I'm in to WIN.
  • #27
  • Jul 11, 2017 7:06am Jul 11, 2017 7:06am
Quoting Madinvestor
I have sacrificed everything to pursue full time trading as career. It's consumed my life. That's enough to keep me going. That includes my marriage, my job, my health, and sanity. Once you've given up all of that, there's really no turning back. If I could do it all over, I would have likely taken it slower and done it differently but it's too late now. It's profit or bust at that point as there's nothing to go back to. If that doesn't motivate, I don't know what else will...
I understand you.

Fortunately I have a good family structure but during this intensive +7 years in trading my health in relation to sleep had some problems, and my emotional side was also affected, but now I'm on the right track.

Good luck
The funniest, is that nobody takes me seriously.
  • #28
  • Jul 11, 2017 7:18am Jul 11, 2017 7:18am
Quoting Artcool
Don't listen to people telling you you need to spend all your life screening the charts and if you are not profitable, that's because you are not trying hard enough and not burning your precious time enough... They just want you to lose your life with this garbage just like they did...because they are still nor profitable after so many years lost trying to find the hidden secret of lazy life. You see the image posted before in this thread? Chances are that you will be coming to the end but you will still be completely broke and old....
I actually think its quite the opposite.

Family and close ones may not fully understand the nature of this business to give you a helpful advice, more often than not they do oppose what we do they think its waste of time and most of them equate trading to gambling. I know mine does. They don't understand what I go through day in and day out. It's a lonely road, so when I'm lost I come here for advice because I have no where else to turn to. Sure there are people full of themselves, or pessimists who like to bash everyone but I've found good people who are willing to listen and direct you to the right path. You just have to know what to listen and what not to listen.
...
  • #29
  • Jul 11, 2017 7:22am Jul 11, 2017 7:22am
Quoting FairTrader
{quote} Yourself gave the answer. Stay where you are if you already have what you need (do not change) and focus on improving the trading method to be consistent. Reduce the risk until you can accept the losses. No need to grab all the pips or be in all trades. Be surgical, choose the best setups. Not be active all day in the market. Go slow and you go far. Less is more. Reach your goal or the best possible, and get out of the market, come back the other day. EDIT: Some screenshots to motivate you {image} {image} {image} {image}


Did you just type them up ?
I do calculations almost everyday on paper to pass time while i'm waiting for a setup. I do enjoy writing them up but I never reach them. That's the problem
...
  • #30
  • Jul 11, 2017 7:30am Jul 11, 2017 7:30am
Quoting Piquant
{quote} Did you just type them up ? I do calculations almost everyday on paper to pass time while i'm waiting for a setup. I do enjoy writing them up but I never reach them. That's the problem
LOL

No, I only change the account and the daily goal percentage values.
Enjoy
Attached File(s)
File Type: xls daily_average.xls   85 KB | 237 downloads
The funniest, is that nobody takes me seriously.
  • #31
  • Jul 11, 2017 7:34am Jul 11, 2017 7:34am
Quoting Piquant
{quote} I actually think its quite the opposite. Family and close ones may not fully understand the nature of this business to give you a helpful advice, more often than not they do oppose what we do they think its waste of time and most of them equate trading to gambling. I know mine does. They don't understand what I go through day in and day out. It's a lonely road, so when I'm lost I come here for advice because I have no where else to turn to. Sure there are people full of themselves, or pessimists who like to bash everyone but I've found good...
That's exactly true. That's the reason I lost my marriage. It is a lonely road. There's no one to talk to that gets it. That's why these forums exist. That's also why I would advise people that are serious about this as a career full time to do it before starting a family. Your family will never understand and you will likely compromise your family in your efforts to do it. Part time is fine, but full time requires too much sacrifice and commitment when you have other obligations in life.
  • #32
  • Jul 11, 2017 7:44am Jul 11, 2017 7:44am
Quoting Piquant
{quote}...As for which route to take, I'll have to give this one a good thought. Maybe I should top it up again with 200$ or 500$ and aim for a doable target.
There's one standout factor that I experienced during the development stage - keep the cost down to as CHEAP as possible.

Trading at 0.01lot will keep the cost of being wrong cheap that will not affect you financially and psychologically. Yes, it will not meet your current monetary requirements but the risk exposure is kept minimal while you polish your method and trade execution/management.

When you are ready, as in you have doubled your balance in a series of trades say over 100 trades, then you can gradually step up to trade at a lot size that's more in line with your goal.

Patience is a key virtue for success and exercising patience and prudence will protect your journey towards that all important goal. Hope this helps.
  • #33
  • Edited 7:58am Jul 11, 2017 7:45am | Edited 7:58am
I really never got unmotivated or stuck in trading because i always believed in me when no one else did. And i wanted to proof these people that i can do it because hate is what keeps you motivated. My goal was to be a full-time trader after school to be able to do what i like to do. I also suffered bad times and i still do but i know that it's a part of my system and they are just small pullbacks in my equity curve. You just need to understand the reasons for it so it won't make you feel uncomfortable or unmotivated in your trading style. Especially in bad times you should be motivated to stick to your system.
  • #34
  • Jul 11, 2017 7:53am Jul 11, 2017 7:53am
Quoting Madinvestor
{quote} That's exactly true. That's the reason I lost my marriage. It is a lonely road. There's no one to talk to that gets it. That's why these forums exist. That's also why I would advise people that are serious about this as a career full time to do it before starting a family. Your family will never understand and you will likely compromise your family in your efforts to do it. Part time is fine, but full time requires too much sacrifice and commitment when you have other obligations in life.
Those who have given up that much, voluntarily or otherwise, are much more in the position to go that extra more miles to do stuff that their contemporaries will not or deem them impossible, insane....you certainly have the enviable upperhand.
  • #35
  • Jul 11, 2017 8:11am Jul 11, 2017 8:11am
Quoting Madinvestor
{quote} That's exactly true. That's the reason I lost my marriage. It is a lonely road. There's no one to talk to that gets it. That's why these forums exist. That's also why I would advise people that are serious about this as a career full time to do it before starting a family. Your family will never understand and you will likely compromise your family in your efforts to do it. Part time is fine, but full time requires too much sacrifice and commitment when you have other obligations in life.
I am sure "full time" trading puts a lot of pressure on the dynamics of your relationship with your spouse. When money is involved and you have responsibilities to bare it is extremely difficult to wake up each day and not worry how the days going turn out. I have no obligation and responsibilities except for myself and yet I still struggle and my family don't understand why I do what I do. They just don't get it. I can only imagine how hard its going to be if you're married and still struggling.
...
  • #36
  • Jul 11, 2017 8:12am Jul 11, 2017 8:12am
Quoting skyway
{quote} There's one standout factor that I experienced during the development stage - keep the cost down to as CHEAP as possible. Trading at 0.01lot will keep the cost of being wrong cheap that will not affect you financially and psychologically. Yes, it will not meet your current monetary requirements but the risk exposure is kept minimal while you polish your method and trade execution/management. When you are ready, as in you have doubled your balance in a series of trades say over 100 trades, then you can gradually step up to trade at a lot...

I'll stay at 50$ with 0.01 lot for now.
Took your advice.

Thank you !
...
  • #37
  • Jul 11, 2017 8:46am Jul 11, 2017 8:46am
Quoting Piquant
How do you keep yourself motivated everyday when you're not making any money ?
I always try and remind myself that not making money, i.e. being flat and waiting is part of the "business" of trading.

Quoting Piquant
Does it help to draw up a challenge or a goal for myself ?
Yes. And that challenge and goal should be "STICK TO MY TRADING PLAN" because setting financial goals (if that is what you were referring) may lead to weariness and frustration - this lady market will only ever give up pips when she's ready to.

Quoting Piquant
? When you feel like you're stuck what do you do ?
Go for a walk, have a beer etc etc. In other words, step back into the real world and clear one's thoughts. Being around people is an excellent tonic.

Quoting Piquant
when you're making actual money paying yourself a salary at the end of the month and a bonus each quarter seem like a great booster to me.
This is the reality check that I think most leveraged retail traders, myself included, have had to, or will need to face up to at some point. It will probably be a long time before regular salary and bonuses are a fact of life if one's sole income is to come from trading. As in most business decisions in life I think it's important to have a backup and not put all our eggs in one basket. Some form of primary income source is crucial for leveraged retail traders but of course this is all down to personal circumstances. There's no universal solution unfortunately.

Quoting Piquant
I'm just tried of trading 0.01lot.
In trading, I think it's important to always think in terms of percentages.

A quick final note... Having a routine helps because it adds structure to the day and certainly assists with discipline. A routine, however, will not help someone who is no longer motivated to carry on trading. I think there's quite an important distinction between searching for how to stay motivated trading, as opposed to understanding that one is no longer motivated to stay trading.

I don't wish to end on a particularly negative note but I do think the question of whether or not one is motivated to carry on trading is an important one for all to consider from time to time. There's nothing wrong whatsoever with the person who can accept that he's no longer motivated to do something. In fact, I can't imagine a bigger waste of life doing something that one is not motivated to do. And so, quite the opposite of considering walking away tantamount to failure, I would actually consider it an extremely positive resolution in certain circumstances.
  • #38
  • Jul 11, 2017 3:53pm Jul 11, 2017 3:53pm
Quoting Piquant
{quote} I am sure "full time" trading puts a lot of pressure on the dynamics of your relationship with your spouse. When money is involved and you have responsibilities to bare it is extremely difficult to wake up each day and not worry how the days going turn out. I have no obligation and responsibilities except for myself and yet I still struggle and my family don't understand why I do what I do. They just don't get it. I can only imagine how hard its going to be if you're married and still struggling.
Yup, you got it. To your point, even though it is difficult, you are in the best position to succeed right now by having no spouse or children. The moment you introduce the kind of uncertainty that comes along with doing this for a living, most people freak out. It all comes down to risk tolerance though. That's why not everyone is cut out for this. I've always been the entrepreneurial type myself, so my risk tolerance is higher than the average person, and I think that is the case for most people trying to pursue their own business let alone trading as a career. It's just a risky business by nature and most see it as gambling no matter how you try to explain to them that you manage your risk effectively. No one believes that it is possible and they frown upon your every effort to do it. I have a BS in finance and accounting and my college professors frowned upon the idea of technical analysis. They believed it was akin to reading tea leaves. I think that motivates me more than anything at this point. I perform best with my back against the wall. I know that if I don't succeed I don't eat. I have no safety, net to fall back on. That's why I started with a live account and lost a ton of money in my efforts. I've done it all. Made every mistake except for blowing an entire account, because I've always put serious money in there which forced me to use good risk management even when my strategy is awful. Now I've drawn down an account to 50% more than once, but as long as you still have an account your still in the game
  • #39
  • Jul 11, 2017 9:49pm Jul 11, 2017 9:49pm
Quoting Madinvestor
{quote} Yup, you got it. To your point, even though it is difficult, you are in the best position to succeed right now by having no spouse or children. The moment you introduce the kind of uncertainty that comes along with doing this for a living, most people freak out. It all comes down to risk tolerance though. That's why not everyone is cut out for this. I've always been the entrepreneurial type myself, so my risk tolerance is higher than the average person, and I think that is the case for most people trying to pursue their own business let...
I wish you all the best !
If we never take risk we never will succeed.
If we wanted to live a mediocre life doing a job that we don't give a damn we wouldn't be here.
You've risked it all, what do you have to lose now ?
We go up from here.
...
  • #40
  • Jul 11, 2017 9:56pm Jul 11, 2017 9:56pm
Quoting simond2002
{quote} I always try and remind myself that not making money, i.e. being flat and waiting is part of the "business" of trading. {quote} Yes. And that challenge and goal should be "STICK TO MY TRADING PLAN" because setting financial goals (if that is what you were referring) may lead to weariness and frustration - this lady market will only ever give up pips when she's ready to. {quote} Go for a walk, have a beer etc etc. In other words, step back into the real world and clear one's thoughts. Being around people is an excellent tonic. {quote} This...
Thank you simond2002 for taking time to write all of this. Its greatly appreciated.

Challenge should to stick to my trading plan and not some imaginary numbers I can come up, indeed wise words. By product of that challenge of following your trading plan should be "profit" not the other way around.
...
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