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Attachments: Perplexed - year spent looking for system
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Perplexed - year spent looking for system

  • #41
  • Quote
  • May 12, 2008 8:35pm May 12, 2008 8:35pm
Quoting M.A.C.Doug
Ok, youve spent a year looking for the holy grail and didnt find it. Great - one lesson learned. Your next move is the J16 subscription. Also good, providing you really have learned the first lesson. Stop looking for push button, automatic profit, trading systems and focus your full attention on what the J16 guys are teaching. Finally after you've mastered PA but find you are still unable to be profitable you will come to the last hurdle - yourself! The all powerful YOU decides whether you will win or lose. If, deep down, you believe you dont deserve to win, you will lose. Even with the best techniques, you will miss winners and risk more on losers or a myriad of other mistakes that will result in losses with the exact same method another trader does very well with. You are on the right path, you are heading in the right direction. Start looking within for answers as to why you have caused your life to be where it is right now, needing market success to solve your problems. Comming to the market without facing yourself first, is a recipe for total disaster as the "my life is ruined" thread demonstrates. How does continually losing money, month after month until you are completely ruined sound? How are you going to prevent this and produce a happier ending against tdions' stacked odds?

sorry to interupt your thread, feel free to disregard my words, Dont take it personally or be offended by anything I have said. These words are intended for myself.
I AGREE..... whatever you said comes from experience and EXPERIENCE IS EVER BOUGHT: NEVER TAUGHT. If we all could learn from others mistakes there will be no fool left in the world. Selfdiscovery comes with a price and the one who is willing to pay it discovers it sooner or later.... depends how long he stays in the markets...
  • #42
  • Quote
  • May 12, 2008 8:40pm May 12, 2008 8:40pm
Quoting tdion
This is absolutely ridiculous. Of course it matters what the market does. I will argue that the market is 100% of your success or failure, because it always has the last word.... not your planning and waiting for setups.
May be you misunderstood what I meant... I meant.... YOUR SUCCESS DOES NOT DEPEND ON MARKET ACTION but YOUR ACTIONS... Still ridiculous...???

YOU ARE 100% OF YOUR SUCCESS OR FAILURE NOT MARKETS.. markets treat everyone the same way.. they offer the same opportunities to everyone at the same time... some lose some win depending on WHAT THEY DO NOT WHAT MARKET DID..
  • #43
  • Quote
  • May 12, 2008 9:42pm May 12, 2008 9:42pm
YOU ARE 100% OF YOUR SUCCESS OR FAILURE

By your logic, we will be 100% successful by not participating.

All the chit chat about YOU are the focus of your own success in trading is BS. Once you hit the buy or sell button, you are helpless. Your skill doesn't mean anything. Your ability to PREDICT and therefore know when to mash the exit button is the same effectiveness as pulling the lever at a slot machine.

SUCCESS IN FOREX IS ALWAYS LUCK, NEVER SKILL
  • #44
  • Quote
  • May 12, 2008 9:49pm May 12, 2008 9:49pm
Quoting Lucky57
IT IS ABSOLUTELY NOT IMPORTANT WHAT MARKET DOES BUT WHAT YOU DO
I like this.

1. Take control of your life.
2. If you lose money on a trade, don't blame the indicators, the broker, your education, or the signs of the zodiac: just look in the mirror.
3. Stop trying to make a profitable trade and make a profitable trade.
4. Get real.

Also, if you trade frequently using the "Pray as you go" method, whereby you make a trade and then pray the market will move in a favorable direction, I have found that chanting really works well, particularly 2 hours after the London open.... try it out, you will be surprised.
  • #45
  • Quote
  • Edited 10:34pm May 12, 2008 10:19pm | Edited 10:34pm
I love it also.
Believe in yourself ... right before the market kicks you in the chops..
all the self help books in the world aint gonna matter if you get hit by a bus.
thats my motto!. and if you think the market or people have to do anything ---... that is folly. Believe me, know one even has to get up in the morning if they don't want to! Anyway, I see no angle mentally in the intra day - hourly. Its just people pure luck. Now, the inter day... I think you have a better shot at making some good coin based on simple basic strategyies. But, thats just my opinion as its only been a few months of good outcomes. Also, I don't know about all this "the market is telling me" bs. Ihave been trading for a few years and the market hasn't said squat to me to tell me where its gonna go..... ..It can go higher or it can go so low your account is wiped out. the only day I am fairly confident is rollover wednesday when greed kicks in. The rest of the week its just all over the place.
  • #46
  • Quote
  • May 12, 2008 10:35pm May 12, 2008 10:35pm
Quoting Lucky57

Remember Edison tried 10000 times to find something that works for a light bulb. that is the kind of resolve you need to win in any business or endevor in life. Frustration is the key.
I think this a misplaced quote.
Edison undestand the concept of light or electricity and how it is produced and transmitted, but was looking for the right the medium to display it. That is why he did not lose hope by trying 1000 times. He knew what he was looking for. Something to convey the electricity in the right format.

Folks He knew about light and electricity. He did not start from no where.

The bulb is just like indicator, if you do not understand what is electricity how can you know the right bulb to use. Or even know what is a bulb.

Fustration is the key? no Edison was not fustrated but had hope because he knew what he was doing. When you are fustrated you cannot move forward. You quit!

This thread has turned to first search for bulb before understanding how market works. Unfortunately there are not up to 1000 indicators so we do not need to try 1000s times to know what is wrong with all the indicators, if we understand what is the problem of study. Market is not Las Vegas, as most people has said here several times.

99% cannot defined problem of being in the market.

Someone once answered me it is because he wants to make money.
Wrong answer! that is not the problem of study in this business And that is not even the problem of being in business.

If you cannot define the problem, there is no problem and there is no need to search 1000 times to find an answer.
  • #47
  • Quote
  • Edited May 13, 2008 1:43am May 12, 2008 10:44pm | Edited May 13, 2008 1:43am
exit i just happened to see this. im going to make a couple of points. my opinions only so no one get edgy or defensive please. these are just my observations from over 25 years of traveling this road.

indicators alone dont work. period - paragraph. the only thing an indicator is good for by itself is identifying divergence and divergence alone will kill you in a trending market.

price is king and always will be. price and support/resistance ( which are a product of price) are the only keys that turn the engine on. indicators can be added to a knowledge of price action to help refine entries or exits but once again as a stand alone entry or exit technique they will always fail you.

once the engine is on only by practice and repetition can a person learn to drive.

anyone that goes live after a month or with someones "system" is as doomed to failure as a kid that might be given a car with no teaching or practice.

this is a business and god knows i paid a dear price learning that.

if a person opened a restaurant that had never cooked would they have any chance of success?

if a person that had never been to dental school have a prayer of doing a root canal succesfully?

why do people think that this is any different from any other business?

95 percent of all businesses fail even when a person knows there chosen field.

we all know that 90 plus percent fail at this business but my question is why does it have to cost people there hard earned money while learning to trade?

people say demo is not the same thing and they are right but its the way to build confidence and learn this business without killing yourself and your bank account.

if a person cant demo trade on a daily chart for 3 straight months positive then they have no business trading live on daily.

if they cant trade succesfully on daily with a live account they certainly have no business going from system to system trading 1 hour or even 4 hour.

but what do new traders do? they start out on 1 hour and within a month they are down to 5 minute because " it produces more trades".

anyone that is serious about making this work must come to a place where common sense overides feelings and desires of quick riches.

If it does not then i can tell anyone that happens to read this with virtually 100 percent certainty that your about to enter a very painful and expensive time in your life.

exit if you will email me i will try to help you get on track whether you ever join or not.

since we started the group i dont "get out" much except for the chart thread but i would be lying if i said i dont miss the forum as a whole.

i always worry about being accused of pimping the group so i keep a low profile but i really am here to help anyone that i can find time for.

its hard for me to find time to breath these days but i always try.

Jim





Quoting exitand4getit
I know a year is not a long time. This is the time I have been on this forum, other forums just don't compare IMHO. But, I have looked at, read and studied most, not all of course, of the systems or any thing else they might be called and I can not come up with a trading system for me to adapt to. Its like nothing is filling the bill.

Whats up with this? Is this normal? Is this going to last long? Some of the EA's are very good but most leave no room for learning. Some of those are being used by people that don't even know the basic, which is of course their choice. For me I want a deeper involvement with my trading business.

Others are so many indicators its confusing and like most of those Pro. traders here like James16, forgive me if I mis-quote, but "all those indicatiors are not needed to successfully trade."

Some others that have systems give you just enough to wet the whistle the rest they want you to pay for and there is nothing wrong with that but at the moment I do not have those funds and I know what some are going to say about that statement.

Others who are moderators of their threads are just down right rude. Ask a simple question and you get a short answer that makes you feel stupid and does not answer the question in the first place.

I really liked Vegas, but we know what happened there. Is any one trading his system on a regular basis?

So are all my feelings of being backed up against a wall, is this normal? Can some one give me some pointers?

I am wanting to order a book by Pring on price action analysis, is this recommended by those of you here that know more then me?

I don't want to go into detail about my life's tragic story, we all have them some worse then others. But I will be doing this for a full time income and I will be faithful to those who help me in ways you allow yourself to, with out me having to ask for free stuff and with out you feeling resentful about helping me.

So I do need direction for the next few months or so. I hope to join James16 in a month or 2.

I do want to say that those I have emailed, read their threads, gained what knowledge I have because of the placement of this forum, the generosity, the kinship I hear in reading between the lines, the respect, I thank you all for this and will in another year be trading with the best and I know I will be sharing with those in my foot steps now.

Thanks!!
  • #48
  • Quote
  • May 12, 2008 10:58pm May 12, 2008 10:58pm
Quoting exitand4getit
I know a year is not a long time. This is the time I have been on this forum, other forums just don't compare IMHO. But, I have looked at, read and studied most, not all of course, of the systems or any thing else they might be called and I can not come up with a trading system for me to adapt to. Its like nothing is filling the bill.

Problem #1 -
You are reading too much into these "systems". Most are written by inexperienced traders, and always seemed to be based on lagging indicators. Can they work? Yes...but some of these systems have so many lines that you can see everything but the price!
Whats up with this? Is this normal? Is this going to last long? Some of the EA's are very good but most leave no room for learning. Some of those are being used by people that don't even know the basic, which is of course their choice. For me I want a deeper involvement with my trading business.

Too much thought is a bad thing. It makes the whole psychology of trading get to you. Thinking is not in itself a bad thing....but doing too much of it is. Horrible. How many times have you talked yourself out of a good trade? (Or anything else for that matter?) Trading is simple, don't over-complicate it.

Others are so many indicators its confusing and like most of those Pro. traders here like James16, forgive me if I mis-quote, but "all those indicatiors are not needed to successfully trade."

For what it's worth, I am profitable. I use S/R lines, and MACD. (MACD is a tip-off for divergence. But this is not reason enough, we still need Price Action to confirm it.)

Some others that have systems give you just enough to wet the whistle the rest they want you to pay for and there is nothing wrong with that but at the moment I do not have those funds and I know what some are going to say about that statement.

Pointless those are.

Others who are moderators of their threads are just down right rude. Ask a simple question and you get a short answer that makes you feel stupid and does not answer the question in the first place.

Of course they are! They don't want to be questioned. This is their domain, and it's the one thing in life that makes them feel good about themselves. (It certainly isn't them market beating the down everyday that gives them a reason to go on.)

I would also say that negativity is not something that you should legitimize by listen to it. Seriously, this is a big challenge. You don't need other people's toxic attitudes or thoughts making it worse. Use them as liquidity, I do.

I really liked Vegas, but we know what happened there. Is any one trading his system on a regular basis?

The are a few "variations" of that system. However, I cannot speak to their effectiveness.

So are all my feelings of being backed up against a wall, is this normal? Can some one give me some pointers?

Ask yourself IMPORTANT QUESTIONS. Believe it or not, I have learned so much about life in these stupid charts. Most movement in the pairs can be categorized as NOISE. This is also true about LIFE. A lot of noise, but all answers are obvious, when you listen....to the right things.

I am wanting to order a book by Pring on price action analysis, is this recommended by those of you here that know more then me?

I recommend two actually: Pring.....and yes, it's similar to J16 and others.....but think of it as a great reference book. "Reminiscences Of A Stock Operator" is the other one. I know it's about trading stocks in the 20's.....but if you really read it, and pay attention, there are some real nuggets in there.

I don't want to go into detail about my life's tragic story, we all have them some worse then others. But I will be doing this for a full time income and I will be faithful to those who help me in ways you allow yourself to, with out me having to ask for free stuff and with out you feeling resentful about helping me.
So I do need direction for the next few months or so. I hope to join James16 in a month or 2.

Joining J16 is the best money I have ever spent in Forex. Period. In fact, the psych guy is so good, I quit smoking after 22 years using his advice on something totally unrellated.

I am actually now a "Senior Member" over there. (It's basically a volunteer instructor.) By all means, I would encourage you to join, and introduce yourself. I am more than willing to walk you along.

Not only did I quit smoking....I went form a break even trader to profitable after two weeks. I haven't had a losing week since early November of 2007. The place is that good. Not only that, I feel I have made friends there.

I do want to say that those I have emailed, read their threads, gained what knowledge I have because of the placement of this forum, the generosity, the kinship I hear in reading between the lines, the respect, I thank you all for this and will in another year be trading with the best and I know I will be sharing with those in my foot steps now.

I like this place a lot as well. But the private forum and this place are two different worlds. On the private side, you have people that are serious enough to PAY to learn. It changes the attitude in a major way. Also, Jim is a great guy, and it's best reflected in his group...and the people that it attracts.

Not that we have ever had an issue with it, but I would guess he would toss someone out who was offensive or rude? I don't know....
 Thanks!!
If there is anything I can do to help, please feel free to PM me.

Clockwork


*** THERE YOU GO.....HE MUST HAVE BEEN HERE AT THE SAME TIME I WAS! lol ***
  • #49
  • Quote
  • May 13, 2008 1:02am May 13, 2008 1:02am
Quoting exitand4getit
I know a year is not a long time. This is the time I have been on this forum, other forums just don't compare IMHO. But, I have looked at, read and studied most, not all of course, of the systems or any thing else they might be called and I can not come up with a trading system for me to adapt to. Its like nothing is filling the bill.

Whats up with this? Is this normal? Is this going to last long? Some of the EA's are very good but most leave no room for learning. Some of those are being used by people that don't even know the basic, which is of course their choice. For me I want a deeper involvement with my trading business.

Others are so many indicators its confusing and like most of those Pro. traders here like James16, forgive me if I mis-quote, but "all those indicatiors are not needed to successfully trade."

Some others that have systems give you just enough to wet the whistle the rest they want you to pay for and there is nothing wrong with that but at the moment I do not have those funds and I know what some are going to say about that statement.

Others who are moderators of their threads are just down right rude. Ask a simple question and you get a short answer that makes you feel stupid and does not answer the question in the first place.

I really liked Vegas, but we know what happened there. Is any one trading his system on a regular basis?

So are all my feelings of being backed up against a wall, is this normal? Can some one give me some pointers?

I am wanting to order a book by Pring on price action analysis, is this recommended by those of you here that know more then me?

I don't want to go into detail about my life's tragic story, we all have them some worse then others. But I will be doing this for a full time income and I will be faithful to those who help me in ways you allow yourself to, with out me having to ask for free stuff and with out you feeling resentful about helping me.

So I do need direction for the next few months or so. I hope to join James16 in a month or 2.

I do want to say that those I have emailed, read their threads, gained what knowledge I have because of the placement of this forum, the generosity, the kinship I hear in reading between the lines, the respect, I thank you all for this and will in another year be trading with the best and I know I will be sharing with those in my foot steps now.

Thanks!!
Hi exitand4getit,

I am also in the similar boat like you. Spent more than a year hopping on (very much part time although) different systems. I did not learn too much about the forex But I have learnt two things. One, never go live unless you are consistently profitable for at least 3 to 6 months in demo. Second, don't spend a dime on any system, any trading group or on any mentors. If I can not learn from the free material here and on net, $99 a month with any trading guru will not take me any where.

As far as the million free systems available here and thousands mentor here, I
have still not given up on one system (4 Hr MACD) and the mentor (Phil) for that system..he is still free..Give that system a chance, it will give you a good knowledge of forex..again not trying to sell the system as I have not personally traded..but watching many threads here for quite some time, came to the conclusion, that system and the thread owner are the very few one here who are still helping newbies free of cost for a considerable length of time.

Good luck in your quest..

-FX_California
  • #50
  • Quote
  • May 13, 2008 5:31am May 13, 2008 5:31am
Quoting tdion
YOU ARE 100% OF YOUR SUCCESS OR FAILURE

By your logic, we will be 100% successful by not participating.

All the chit chat about YOU are the focus of your own success in trading is BS. Once you hit the buy or sell button, you are helpless. Your skill doesn't mean anything. Your ability to PREDICT and therefore know when to mash the exit button is the same effectiveness as pulling the lever at a slot machine.

SUCCESS IN FOREX IS ALWAYS LUCK, NEVER SKILL

  1. Dont push the button without finding your edge.
  2. If you dont have an edge; dont trade.
  3. Hitting the buy or sell button does not need any skill but to find the reason to hit a button does need skill.
  4. If one thinks trading is the same as pulling the lever at slot machine; better pull the slot machine lever becasue trading is not GAMBLING.
  5. Success in anything including gambling is always skill. Professinal gamblers who manage their money well come out winners.

FOOLS RELY ON LUCK, WISE CREATE THEIR OWN LUCK

  • #51
  • Quote
  • May 13, 2008 6:14am May 13, 2008 6:14am
Quoting fxbroker
I think this a misplaced quote.
Edison undestand the concept of light or electricity and how it is produced and transmitted, but was looking for the right the medium to display it. That is why he did not lose hope by trying 1000 times. He knew what he was looking for. Something to convey the electricity in the right format.

Folks He knew about light and electricity. He did not start from no where.

The bulb is just like indicator, if you do not understand what is electricity how can you know the right bulb to use. Or even know what is a bulb.

Fustration is the key? no Edison was not fustrated but had hope because he knew what he was doing. When you are fustrated you cannot move forward. You quit!

This thread has turned to first search for bulb before understanding how market works. Unfortunately there are not up to 1000 indicators so we do not need to try 1000s times to know what is wrong with all the indicators, if we understand what is the problem of study. Market is not Las Vegas, as most people has said here several times.

99% cannot defined problem of being in the market.

Someone once answered me it is because he wants to make money.
Wrong answer! that is not the problem of study in this business And that is not even the problem of being in business.

If you cannot define the problem, there is no problem and there is no need to search 1000 times to find an answer.
Dear FXBroker,

When I quoted Edison and the number of his tries the point I wanted to make was his persistence:

To excell or succeed in any endeavor in life persistence is needed; number of tries don't matter. you may succeed in your first attempt and you may not after 1000 attempts. The person who is still trying and working is not a failure no matter how long it takes for him to find a solution. He may never find a solution for the problem he is working on. As long as he is trying, he is not a failure.

Frustration FUELS your passion. It is a very positive emotion if properly harnessed. The more I failed and became frustrated, the stronger my resolve became to achieve success.
  • #52
  • Quote
  • May 13, 2008 6:56am May 13, 2008 6:56am
Quoting Lucky57
Dear FXBroker,

When I quoted Edison and the number of his tries the point I wanted to make was his persistence:

To excell or succeed in any endeavor in life persistence is needed; number of tries don't matter. you may succeed in your first attempt and you may not after 1000 attempts. The person who is still trying and working is not a failure no matter how long it takes for him to find a solution. He may never find a solution for the problem he is working on. As long as he is trying, he is not a failure.

Frustration FUELS your passion. It is a very positive emotion if properly harnessed. The more I failed and became frustrated, the stronger my resolve became to achieve success.
I agree with you on persistence - but that is different from when someone is negatively persistence. You see people can be persistence even when they are wrong. that cannot produce any advancement or contribution to human knowledge.

In Edison's case he was very much aware and highly knowledgeable
about what is light. His 1000s trials (research) does not mean he did not produced other means of producing light from electricity, but his best was the bulb.

I think the post by james16, said so much of I am trying to say.
We need to differentiate between knowledge of something and a system (technique, method) to solve the problems associated with what we know (knowldge).

There is no need to start searching for indicator (system or technique) to solve a problem if we do not know the problem.
  • #53
  • Quote
  • May 13, 2008 10:06am May 13, 2008 10:06am
Thanks to all of you for responding to my post, even those of you who have discussed things among yourself, responding to each others words of wisdom.

You have opened my minds eye to things I haven't thought of yet. I know the feeling of trying to predict the movement of the next candle or bar, each time it always seems to go in the other direction with out exception, lol.

Its like the market knows what I just traded, i.e. a buy or sell. I know some have encouraged me not to waist my money on James16, but i feel this is my next move in my learning curve.

I have seen a lot of web pages of those who sell their systems or they sell something related to forex. Most web pages seem to be a big bait and switch system, I mean once they have you, you being the fish they just caught, now they gut you, take all your money and leave you naked with nothing to show.

Those of you who post steps to follow in trading, I don't want to put your names here, you know who you are, I am afraid I would leave some one out and they would get offended, but thanks so much!!

I will follow all the wisdom you guys have shared with me! i will email those who suggested me to do that.

I think of how it must be to trade live. Your own money on the line, its so true it has to be money one is able to lose not money you need, even my wife, who has never read a word about trading, says the money has to be money you consider lost.

I think its cool how my wife is supporting me in this trading venture. She has stood by me so much. I have blown so much money on trying to start work at home, its so frustrating how people want your money so bad they are willing to do, say anything to get it. When you experience disability, at least for me, I realized the value of the mighty dollar. before I always had money. I made 100 grand a year, now I make less then 20. You really do have to watch every dollar. Maybe you see why this trading business and I do see it as a business, it has to be successful. So I will take my time, read and study all legitimate info. I can and practice, practice, practice

I feel the people in this forum, you who have responded to this thread, those who started this whole forum, those who I have met who are james16 members and instructors are the best of people.

I am excited in joining in to this world of trading and the people I will meet and maybe one day face to face, hum a FF reunion. A annual reunion would be cool. Heck I couldn't afford to go for a while anyway.

Your the greatest!!!
Thanks, Jonathan
  • #54
  • Quote
  • May 13, 2008 11:13am May 13, 2008 11:13am
I agree quite a lot with Tdion.

Luck has a big part to play in forex - but it's not everything, what you do when your luck is in is what makes the difference.

Have a look at these books that so many of you revere - market wizards as an example. These famous traders are almost all the recipient of some luck. They all tell tales of their 'big strike' - the one where they traded too heavy, sweated it out and won. that strike often just kickstarted their career at the right time. for every guru that had the lucky strike there were 99 others laying in the gutter.

Many of you love the stories of Richard Dennis - he was lucky too for a while - but then he went to almost 80% drawdown in an account and quit the game. quitting is good - quit whilst you are ahead though not when the house is burning.

Luck is a big part in forex. as Tdion says, when you place that trade you are then in the hands of lady luck. The key in this game is that when lady luck smiles at you you smile back, take her on a date, caress her, get her slightly drunk, talke her home and then .... errm, ok sorry, thought this was youporn lol.

Its what you do with the winners and what you do with the losers that matters - maximise on the wins - that's what the pro's do.

The number one rule is to get out of the casino when you are winning and don't hang around. Make the trades - win then call it quits for the day - take the money and run. Give yourself a single trade loss limit, a daily loss limit, a weekly loss limit. if you hit it then get out the house, if you make a good trade then juice it again and again, slap that fu&*^%r around and get everything you can out of it and then GET OUT

They say quitters never win - it's a lie to keep you in the house. smart quitters do win - they quit when they are ahead.

That's the game, entries dont matter a toss.
youtube.com/SoultraderForex
  • #55
  • Quote
  • May 13, 2008 11:57am May 13, 2008 11:57am
once again im not trying to ruffle feathers. im just speaking from experience and people can take from it what they wish.

if a trader is entering trades thinking "man i hope i get lucky" they are in deep deep trouble.

smart, well thought out entries with a rifle shot mentality can get a trader into positions that are "effective" virtually every time.

a hard earned accomplished knowledge of s/r can make them winners because you know where to exit or get your stop to breakeven.

luck has nothing to do with it and if it does its not being treated as a business and your gonna crash and burn.

i will post a chart example and it wont be some crazy system. it will be dirt simple.

jim
  • #56
  • Quote
  • May 13, 2008 12:11pm May 13, 2008 12:11pm
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  • #57
  • Quote
  • May 13, 2008 12:44pm May 13, 2008 12:44pm
Quoting soultrader
Its what you do with the winners and what you do with the losers that matters - maximise on the wins - that's what the pro's do.
.
This doesn't have anything to do with luck. This is personal evolution on how one deals with the market. If luck is willing to go home with you and watch a movie (that is what you were talking about?) and you don't bother to ask it home, then you weren't able to bring luck home to begin with? I will rephrase, if you can get "lucky" with a trade and you don't, are you then not lucky? In the past, and honestly still today, I am often ahead 1.5% on a trade (I don't trade with leverage) in a matter of a day or two and I don't get out. I naturally want more as I hunt for big trends. Then when I am staring at a -2.5% drawdown should I say that I am now "unlucky". If I got out of that trade I would have been lucky or no? Could I only say I was lucky if I reached my 10% target?

Folks, luck isn't what wins in this market. It is exactly what SoulTrader said, even though I was just questioning him, it is how you deal with "luck", if that is what one wants to call it. I like to call it something less supernatural ... like circumstance. I will bend and say that in some forms luck is involved, but that same luck applies to everyone ... the winners and losers both deal with the exact same thing. If a loser in the market thinks that they are unlucky, versus a winner, they are just an extremely egocentric person. Everyone deals with c#*p, it isn't as though Goldman puts a trade on oil and never sees red.

As an attempted contribution to this thread, just zoom out. Some have success on 5 minute charts, though they are rare and how long will it last? Look at daily charts. Design a way to manage your losses and your wins, money management is quite important. Look for a way to ride the big trends you see and make sure your account survives long enough to do so, meaning .. don't use too much leverage .. if any at all. It may take a couple years to catch that big trend, you aren't going to make a killing when it happens either. Just know though that even Buffett, the greatest trader, well, at least the richest one, "only" returns around 25% average per year. Why should you do any better than that? The average "trader" starts out with probably $2000, they have a long way to go before they can live off of 15 - 25% per year.
The market is my nation. Traders, my family. Hello, brothers and sisters!
  • #58
  • Quote
  • May 13, 2008 12:56pm May 13, 2008 12:56pm
Quoting exitand4getit
Its like the market knows what I just traded, i.e. a buy or sell. I know some have encouraged me not to waist my money on James16, but i feel this is my next move in my learning curve.

I have seen a lot of web pages of those who sell their systems or they sell something related to forex. Most web pages seem to be a big bait and switch system, I mean once they have you, you being the fish they just caught, now they gut you, take all your money and leave you naked with nothing to show.
1. You said above "it is like the market knows what I just traded,
i'e a buy or sell"

I tthink you just got the answer. Now, find a method that will allow
you to turn the table against the market......to know what the market
have traded, instead of the market knowing what you have trade. I am not making joke but that is the missing link - if you know what the market
will do ........at every minute every pivot livel you are on your way to winning.

I am also glad you will take some tutorial from James16. If you listen to people telling you there is no need, tell them to show you their own results.
Please do not get me wrong. I do not know him but his posts to me shows more maturity and success path you can imitate.


Those people saying no need to pay for training courses that will make a difference to their trading simply do not have the money to start trading. I walked that line 2 years back too, with only $500 as start equity, it doesn't pay, I ended up losing more mini accounts than the most expensive training packages around.

The other alternative is to embark upon something totally different from the scratch where you are the originator and the owner and addresses what other methods you have used in the past could not. That too is expensive, it will mean years of research and hard work sometimes without income.







  • #59
  • Quote
  • May 13, 2008 5:56pm May 13, 2008 5:56pm
Quoting james16
chart
im sorry James, but the experience oif someone who lives off the $200 a month of other traders isnt worth much to me. No disrespect meant as i'm sure you are a nice guy and there's plenty of money to be made from other traders. But i trade every day real size in these markets and that's the experience im using - your answer was rather patronising.

not to ruffle feathers of course.

question - if that was an 'almost 100% certainty' trade how many hundreds of lots did you have riding on it? did you re-mortgage the house when you saw it? if it was a large trade can we see?, did you call it in your room / site? and if no to any of these why not?

You can show rejection bars all day long and for every one that you show i can find one that didnt work. Hindsight is a wonderful trading system and rejection bars are far away from 100% sure thing - to suggest they are is ridiculous.

However, on saying that I do use rejection bars and support and resistance in my trading, just because i do does not mean that luck does not play a large part. anyone who says otherwise must believe in prediction and we all know where that leads.

rejection bars have the ability to keep losers small and if you've any sense you'll just follow em upwards / Downwards and not have a target. you never know where they'll go and if they don't then you'll still take some pie. Ive even written code the autotrade the things so i'm not saying they are useless. But they do lose and often.

No-one takes a trade thinking 'man i hope i'm lucky' of course (well, not often ), but it doesnt matter how you approach it, sometimes you're the hunter an sometimes the Fox. everything else is just invented in the traders mind - like the craps players who believe they can influence the way the dice fall by how hard they blow and throw.

when talking support and resistance - remember support isnt support until it's held and resistance aint resistance till it's rejected - until then it's potential and even then how far till it really is support and not just a breather? 10 pips? 20? 50?

my rules are like this - don't need a chart - if its going up buy, if its going down sell. if it keeps going up - keep buying etc etc - you get the idea right?

lady luck plays a big part - ask John Henry or Ed Seykota if it does - they'll tell you that if they are lucky enough to tag into the trend then they'll milk that luck as much as they can.

Don't take my word for it - just ask the masters.
youtube.com/SoultraderForex
  • #60
  • Quote
  • May 13, 2008 6:29pm May 13, 2008 6:29pm
every time i try to step out of my chart thread this happens. i knew it would this time also. im sure im going to get some emails from all my subs wondering why they are paying 129 instead of 200 and why its free after a year. must be because i make my living off of it. as always im available to help anyone i can free of charge in my chart thread or thru email.

sorry if i offended anyone with my posts,

jim

Quoting soultrader
im sorry James, but the experience oif someone who lives off the $200 a month of other traders isnt worth much to me. No disrespect meant as i'm sure you are a nice guy and there's plenty of money to be made from other traders. But i trade every day real size in these markets and that's the experience im using - your answer was rather patronising.

not to ruffle feathers of course.

question - if that was an 'almost 100% certainty' trade how many hundreds of lots did you have riding on it? did you re-mortgage the house when you saw it? if it was a large trade can we see?, did you call it in your room / site? and if no to any of these why not?

You can show rejection bars all day long and for every one that you show i can find one that didnt work. Hindsight is a wonderful trading system and rejection bars are far away from 100% sure thing - to suggest they are is ridiculous.

However, on saying that I do use rejection bars and support and resistance in my trading, just because i do does not mean that luck does not play a large part. anyone who says otherwise must believe in prediction and we all know where that leads.

rejection bars have the ability to keep losers small and if you've any sense you'll just follow em upwards / Downwards and not have a target. you never know where they'll go and if they don't then you'll still take some pie. Ive even written code the autotrade the things so i'm not saying they are useless. But they do lose and often.

No-one takes a trade thinking 'man i hope i'm lucky' of course (well, not often ), but it doesnt matter how you approach it, sometimes you're the hunter an sometimes the Fox. everything else is just invented in the traders mind - like the craps players who believe they can influence the way the dice fall by how hard they blow and throw.

when talking support and resistance - remember support isnt support until it's held and resistance aint resistance till it's rejected - until then it's potential and even then how far till it really is support and not just a breather? 10 pips? 20? 50?

my rules are like this - don't need a chart - if its going up buy, if its going down sell. if it keeps going up - keep buying etc etc - you get the idea right?

lady luck plays a big part - ask John Henry or Ed Seykota if it does - they'll tell you that if they are lucky enough to tag into the trend then they'll milk that luck as much as they can.

Don't take my word for it - just ask the masters.
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