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Back to basics or information overload? 12 replies

Information overload 10 replies

HELP - Information Overload 9 replies

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Help@ info overload!

  • Post #1
  • Quote
  • First Post: Dec 15, 2005 7:25am Dec 15, 2005 7:25am
I'm overloaded with too much trading information and find difficulty in putting everything in perspective . anyone can help?
You need to be more specific man. What are you overloaded from? too many indicators? too many fundamental data? too many different TA systems?

Please elaborate a little bit more.
yup.. there is an unlimited amount of ways to confuse urself.. (imho) all u need is a sound understanding of basic TA.. everything else is reflected in that, so why overcomplicate the matter .. (up or down and when)

rgds..
Quoting dsvt1
yup.. there is an unlimited amount of ways to confuse urself.. (imho) all u need is a sound understanding of basic TA.. everything else is reflected in that, so why overcomplicate the matter .. (up or down and when)

rgds..
Hi
Markets have certain ingrained behaviors which, when recognised, can be expoited for profit. Focus on these and you'll be well on your way to being able to pick and choose what you use for your analysis.
Try to get a basic understanding of the Dow Theory and build on that. I truly believe its the best place to start otherwise you may find yourself on an "indicator merry go-round" which at best is a waist of time and at worst..... well you know.

All the Best,
Steve
I was here, here I was. Was I here? Yes I was!
Quoting Blackship
I'm overloaded with too much trading information and find difficulty in putting everything in perspective . anyone can help?
I used to teach a six week industrial electronics class. It was focused on a million dollar cigarette making machine that had hundreds of circuit cards with hundreds of components on each card, nearly 200 miles of wiring, 150 relays, 27 motors, over 300 optical and ferrous detectors and 4 CPU's. All of which worked together sending thousands of different electronic signals between all the components at very high speed. All this to churn out cigarettes at the rate of 8000 per minute. I required my students to know the purpose of every component on that machine, down to the smallest chip and to understand all the intricate timing signals that went between the components and the purpose of each.

I usually had between 8 and 12 students per class. Invariably, by the fourth week, they're eyes would be glazed over and all I would hear was "This is too much", "I'm overloaded", "I can't see the big picture","It's not possible to tie all this information together".

They wouldn't believe me when I told them not to sweat it and that by the end of the fifth week most of them would wake up one morning and they would find that suddenly everything had fallen into place and they could then grasp the whole picture at once with almost total understanding.

And this did happen to most of the students by the end of the fifth week. By the end of the sixth week, every student was relaxed and confident that they knew that machine forwards and backwards.

I taught that class 18 times over a three year period, and saw this happen for each and every class.

The cause? I knew that while the concious mind of each student was overwhelmed, the subconcious mind was busy sorting, grouping, categorizing, correlating and organizing the disparate facts about that machine into a coherent whole. Knowing this, I encouraged the students to get plenty of sleep to give their subconcious minds time to do it's job.

In the middle of one of those nights, the subconcious mind finished it's job and presented the result to the concious mind, which is why the students literally woke up one morning during the last two weeks of the class with sudden clarity.

Same thing goes for learning to trade. Yes, there is a lot to learn, but keep shoveling it into your brain. Read until you turn crosseyed. Demo until your seeing charts in your dreams. Be in more than one book at a time so the ideas from one book will reinforce the ideas from another. And when you start to feel the mental overload, just smile and realize that is the signal to you that your brain is doing it's job and will soon part the curtain of understanding for you.

Hang in there. Keep studying like a madman, and you WILL achieve understanding.

Dial
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Quoting diallist
I used to teach a six week industrial electronics class. It was focused on a million dollar cigarette making machine that had hundreds of circuit cards with hundreds of components on each card, nearly 200 miles of wiring, 150 relays, 27 motors, over 300 optical and ferrous detectors and 4 CPU's. All of which worked together sending thousands of different electronic signals between all the components at very high speed. All this to churn out cigarettes at the rate of 8000 per minute. I required my students to know the purpose of every component on that machine, down to the smallest chip and to understand all the intricate timing signals that went between the components and the purpose of each.

I usually had between 8 and 12 students per class. Invariably, by the fourth week, they're eyes would be glazed over and all I would hear was "This is too much", "I'm overloaded", "I can't see the big picture","It's not possible to tie all this information together".

They wouldn't believe me when I told them not to sweat it and that by the end of the fifth week most of them would wake up one morning and they would find that suddenly everything had fallen into place and they could then grasp the whole picture at once with almost total understanding.

And this did happen to most of the students by the end of the fifth week. By the end of the sixth week, every student was relaxed and confident that they knew that machine forwards and backwards.

I taught that class 18 times over a three year period, and saw this happen for each and every class.

The cause? I knew that while the concious mind of each student was overwhelmed, the subconcious mind was busy sorting, grouping, categorizing, correlating and organizing the disparate facts about that machine into a coherent whole. Knowing this, I encouraged the students to get plenty of sleep to give their subconcious minds time to do it's job.

In the middle of one of those nights, the subconcious mind finished it's job and presented the result to the concious mind, which is why the students literally woke up one morning during the last two weeks of the class with sudden clarity.

Same thing goes for learning to trade. Yes, there is a lot to learn, but keep shoveling it into your brain. Read until you turn crosseyed. Demo until your seeing charts in your dreams. Be in more than one book at a time so the ideas from one book will reinforce the ideas from another. And when you start to feel the mental overload, just smile and realize that is the signal to you that your brain is doing it's job and will soon part the curtain of understanding for you.

Hang in there. Keep studying like a madman, and you WILL achieve understanding.

Dial
what a great post man. there's gold in this post.
thanks for the insight
Quoting diallist
I used to teach a six week industrial electronics class. It was focused on a million dollar cigarette making machine that had hundreds of circuit cards with hundreds of components on each card, nearly 200 miles of wiring, 150 relays, 27 motors, over 300 optical and ferrous detectors and 4 CPU's. All of which worked together sending thousands of different electronic signals between all the components at very high speed. All this to churn out cigarettes at the rate of 8000 per minute. I required my students to know the purpose of every component on that machine, down to the smallest chip and to understand all the intricate timing signals that went between the components and the purpose of each.

I usually had between 8 and 12 students per class. Invariably, by the fourth week, they're eyes would be glazed over and all I would hear was "This is too much", "I'm overloaded", "I can't see the big picture","It's not possible to tie all this information together".

They wouldn't believe me when I told them not to sweat it and that by the end of the fifth week most of them would wake up one morning and they would find that suddenly everything had fallen into place and they could then grasp the whole picture at once with almost total understanding.

And this did happen to most of the students by the end of the fifth week. By the end of the sixth week, every student was relaxed and confident that they knew that machine forwards and backwards.

I taught that class 18 times over a three year period, and saw this happen for each and every class.

The cause? I knew that while the concious mind of each student was overwhelmed, the subconcious mind was busy sorting, grouping, categorizing, correlating and organizing the disparate facts about that machine into a coherent whole. Knowing this, I encouraged the students to get plenty of sleep to give their subconcious minds time to do it's job.

In the middle of one of those nights, the subconcious mind finished it's job and presented the result to the concious mind, which is why the students literally woke up one morning during the last two weeks of the class with sudden clarity.

Same thing goes for learning to trade. Yes, there is a lot to learn, but keep shoveling it into your brain. Read until you turn crosseyed. Demo until your seeing charts in your dreams. Be in more than one book at a time so the ideas from one book will reinforce the ideas from another. And when you start to feel the mental overload, just smile and realize that is the signal to you that your brain is doing it's job and will soon part the curtain of understanding for you.

Hang in there. Keep studying like a madman, and you WILL achieve understanding.

Dial
Quoting Blackship
I'm overloaded with too much trading information and find difficulty in putting everything in perspective . anyone can help?
Diallist post and approach was actually great and more than elaborative...If you want my opinion as well, here it is...

There are 2 factors for this problem:

1- You should work it backwards, which means that you at first under-load yourself and don't push it hard, no rush...You can start getting the information, reading and analyzing for a defined period of the day, say only 3 hours, and then you increase gradually till you reach the maximum you can achieve

2- To do this correctly, you will need to know yourself better than anything else...Almost 80% of the information we have access to is not actually important to us...The whole load of information is extremely important for sure to everyone, but see what you are interested in and get, read and analyze related information...

Actually this is Van Tharps' approach to correctly handling information, backwards, you define what you are not interested in and throw it away, and then you are only left with what you are really interested to know, so you read it and analyze it better...

For example, if you are interested in the GBP/USD pair, then you are not interested in the US or UK stocks, you are not interested in the oil futures, you are not interested in the USD/JPY pair, and so on...So you will only read information and analyze information related to this specific pair...You judge, if you are looking to master everything about the GBP/USD and you want to do this because you are sure that it will make you trade it better, then you will have to define what information is related to the pair and of importance to you and which is not...

Step by step, you will find yourself only reading and analyzing information that you are really interested in and eventually you will find that you are not over-loaded anymore...


Thanks,

Nader
thanks guys, I will try not to rush things.Rome is not built in a day
Quoting diallist
Same thing goes for learning to trade. Yes, there is a lot to learn, but keep shoveling it into your brain. Read until you turn crosseyed. Demo until your seeing charts in your dreams. Be in more than one book at a time so the ideas from one book will reinforce the ideas from another. And when you start to feel the mental overload, just smile and realize that is the signal to you that your brain is doing it's job and will soon part the curtain of understanding for you.
For the first time ever, I must disagree with Diallist.

I do not believe in overstudying nor overtheorizing (if such word exists). I do not believe that one must nail down absolutely every single twist of trading in order to become successful. I do not believe you need to keep shoveling trading material into your brain, nor do I believe in devouring different books at a same time. In my opinion, human brain is extremly selective and keen on getting saturated from overdose.

So what do I believe in as far as trading goes? specialization. Do not try to integrate Niison's candlesticks with a Bunny crossover strategy while throwing in James16's pin bar and a little bit of pivot bouncing to add flavor in it. That's a mess and no good can come out of it. In stead, pick up ONE aspect of trading (such as for example pattern breakouts or trendline bounces) and chew it through until you have squeezed all the juice of it, demo trading and studying ONLY what's related to that very trading field. See if it works for you (ie: make money with it). If you do, pat yourself in the back because you have found an "edge". Now, do NOT start messing around trying to explore new stuff adding it up to what already works. If there is one universal truth that applies to trading, that is "if it aint broken, dont fix it". Remember the ONLY point in trading is to make money, not to become a market erudite, and you do NOT need to dig into every trading system, every trading book, every trading technique in order to make money.

I personally do not know ANYTHING about candle formations, about MA crossovers, about indicators or about fundamental analysis, yet my trading is profitable using the same two or three tools I do know about over and over and over. That's what this is all about mate, do not get yourself confused with a never-ending studying. Cherry-pick a handful of tools that work for you and exploit them to superlative levels, and forget about all the rest.
blackship..............
allow me to add MHO to what has already been said by dialist and wtb:
I believe both are right in their own way because everyone is different and not everyone responds the same way to the same type of learning and stimulus. One person may respond as described by dialist, another as described by wtb.......the key to your success is to determine what type of learning and stimulus works best for you and allows you to achieve the success you desire. Successful trading is not done in the same way by everyone who is a successful trader. Each has his own methods, systems, strategem and what works well for one person may not necesarily work well for the next. In any learning environment there are a variety of teaching methods employed with the goal being to help the student maximize his experience in a way that is best for his own individual personality and makeup. This why some people "relate" better to one teacher rather than another. It's not about ciriculum because both are teaching the same thing, it's about THE teaching itself and how a person relates to it. Any parent knows that different children respond differently to discipline. The method that works well for one child may not work well with another, adaptation is required to reach each child on a personal level that he/she can relate and respond to. As adults, we are the same, our responses are different because we are different.
I suggest you take a good look at yourself and decide what type of a learning process makes you thrive, producing the best results in the long run. After you make that honest appraisal, then you can either fill your brain with all the information you can acquire or focus on one style of trading that is comfortable for you until you master that and become profitable as a trader. (Or subsequently, examine several trading styles seperately until you find the one you like best). All of this takes considerable time and devotion. You need to know yourself first before you can master trading the Forex. HTH!

good trading to all..............

BB
Just jumping on the bandwagon, right in the middle of the durum section. What Dialist said is right on. I am as old as dirt and have done a lot of training in my time. I have seen the same thing over and over.

I best experienced it myself while in the U.S. Army (HUHA!) and learning to speak read and write Thai. The course runs for a year, but if you don't pass the six-week exam you are toast. You get to go to cook school and end up in some out of the way place lake Alaska, or at that time it was Nam. It got so bad that we would get up in the middle of the night and sleep walk while speaking Thai and then pee in the waste basket and then light our desk on fire. That is some real stress! But once again at about week six, things calmed down, we became sane and we spent the rest of the year working hard and having fun in the California fog of lovely Carmel and the north coast. So a big Cali right arm to big D. (right arm, right arm, farm out dude!!!)
Nolite dormiens pungere ursum. -- Latan Proverb.
Quoting MrWhipple
Just jumping on the bandwagon, right in the middle of the durum section. What Dialist said is right on. I am as old as dirt and have done a lot of training in my time. I have seen the same thing over and over.

I best experienced it myself while in the U.S. Army (HUHA!) and learning to speak read and write Thai. The course runs for a year, but if you don't pass the six-week exam you are toast. You get to go to cook school and end up in some out of the way place lake Alaska, or at that time it was Nam. It got so bad that we would get up in the middle of the night and sleep walk while speaking Thai and then pee in the waste basket and then light our desk on fire. That is some real stress! But once again at about week six, things calmed down, we became sane and we spent the rest of the year working hard and having fun in the California fog of lovely Carmel and the north coast. So a big Cali right arm to big D. (right arm, right arm, farm out dude!!!)
I think MrWhipple confirms what I wrote earlier. Different people respond differently to different styles of education. Those in his example who washed out at the six week mark were unable to learn in the environment that overloaded a person with information. Those hapless soldiers who got sent away MIGHT have been able to learn the same thing that MW and his desk-burning friends learned, IF the method of teaching had been different, a style (or instructor) they could relate to. Figure out what works BEST for you as an individual and pursue it with a vengence!

good trading to all.......

BB
  • Post #15
  • Quote
  • Last Post: Dec 17, 2005 10:39am Dec 17, 2005 10:39am
Quoting WTB
For the first time ever, I must disagree with Diallist.

I do not believe in overstudying nor overtheorizing (if such word exists). I do not believe that one must nail down absolutely every single twist of trading in order to become successful. I do not believe you need to keep shoveling trading material into your brain, nor do I believe in devouring different books at a same time. In my opinion, human brain is extremly selective and keen on getting saturated from overdose.

So what do I believe in as far as trading goes? specialization. Do not try to integrate Niison's candlesticks with a Bunny crossover strategy while throwing in James16's pin bar and a little bit of pivot bouncing to add flavor in it. That's a mess and no good can come out of it. In stead, pick up ONE aspect of trading (such as for example pattern breakouts or trendline bounces) and chew it through until you have squeezed all the juice of it, demo trading and studying ONLY what's related to that very trading field. See if it works for you (ie: make money with it). If you do, pat yourself in the back because you have found an "edge". Now, do NOT start messing around trying to explore new stuff adding it up to what already works. If there is one universal truth that applies to trading, that is "if it aint broken, dont fix it". Remember the ONLY point in trading is to make money, not to become a market erudite, and you do NOT need to dig into every trading system, every trading book, every trading technique in order to make money.

I personally do not know ANYTHING about candle formations, about MA crossovers, about indicators or about fundamental analysis, yet my trading is profitable using the same two or three tools I do know about over and over and over. That's what this is all about mate, do not get yourself confused with a never-ending studying. Cherry-pick a handful of tools that work for you and exploit them to superlative levels, and forget about all the rest.
WTB is dead right. Learn the basics of market behavior, a little money/risk management and a simple and effective way to trade and that's about all you need. The rest is just a mind game.

Point of fact; you do not need to attend four years of university and get a degree in marine biology to catch a fish.

Steve
I was here, here I was. Was I here? Yes I was!
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