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  • #1,421
  • May 11, 2019 9:54pm May 11, 2019 9:54pm
Quoting bluesteele
Just some.random Saturday thoughts on Gaps........ There's no comparison between trading traditional Gaps and "Hidden" gaps.. I've traded ALOT of weekend gaps quite successfully over many years......but also have been bitten hard on them years ago ... Now I tend to shy away from those types of gaps... The "hidden" liquidity gaps are new to me. George enlightened me to them...to say the least. They are now a big part of my trading and to be quite frank are a very very high probability trade setup ...combined with other filters.. Hundreds of...
Wow -- excellent post. Lots of good information. Thanks Kevin.
  • #1,422
  • May 11, 2019 9:57pm May 11, 2019 9:57pm
Quoting DiamondMiner
{quote} I'll let you know what I think after I do. P
@DiamondMiner -- thanks for not taking my response too personally. It will be interesting to learn what you come up with. I'm working on a similar indicator and I'd like to end up with the best from both worlds. So, any and all feedback helps.
  • #1,423
  • May 11, 2019 10:05pm May 11, 2019 10:05pm
Quoting bluesteele
Just some.random Saturday thoughts on Gaps........ There's no comparison between trading traditional Gaps and "Hidden" gaps.. I've traded ALOT of weekend gaps quite successfully over many years......but also have been bitten hard on them years ago ... Now I tend to shy away from those types of gaps... The "hidden" liquidity gaps are new to me. George enlightened me to them...to say the least. They are now a big part of my trading and to be quite frank are a very very high probability trade setup ...combined with other filters.. Hundreds of...
A closer look at the PRECISENESS of the market.....

Now can you imagine placing a pending order to buy or sell at some of these levels...Especially when one takes into account
the ADR...the ADR of the session...Momentum/MAs TIME/BALANCE....etc etc.. etc... This is part of the reason why for example I have many entries
and exits within a fraction of a pip of highs and lows.

AND THIS IS ONLY POSSIBLE AFTER I OPENED UP MY EYES AND MINDSET TO THE PSYCHOLOGY OF THE MM.
ALL CREDIT TO GEORGE !!!!

Now can you imagine trading into and away from these levels ? Completely doable....And quite a smart way to say get in early on
some of these uhmmmm "trends" hahaha... Selling that top at 146.508 ? Possible ? Well i know a few people that sold it

4hr and D "Trend" trades with entries off of the 1M chart and TMAs combined with these "Liquidity Gaps" and other MM levels....
All possible with experience.....
All possible when one becomes boundless as George has shown over and over to several of us....
And honestly even much more than is even being discussed here....

Cheers
Kevin

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Master your Mind,,,Master the Market
  • #1,424
  • May 11, 2019 10:45pm May 11, 2019 10:45pm
https://www.investopedia.com/terms/l/liquidity-gap.asp


Liquidity Gap

Reviewed by Will Kenton (https://www.investopedia.com/contributors/53661/)
Updated Feb 27, 2018
What is Liquidity Gap
Liquidity gap is a term used in several types of financial situation to describe a discrepancy or mismatch in the supply or demand for a security or the maturity dates of securities. Banks deal with liquidity risks and potential liquidity gaps to the extent that they need to make sure they have enough cash on hand at all times to meet requests for funds. When the maturity of assets and liabilities differ, or there is larger than expected demand for funds, the bank might experience a shortage of cash and therefore a liquidity gap.

BREAKING DOWN Liquidity Gap
A firm may also experience a liquidity gap when they do not have enough cash on hand to meet operational needs and they have assets and liabilities maturing at different times. Liquidity gaps can also occur in the markets when there is an insufficient number of investors to take the opposite side of a trade and people looking to sell their securities are unable to do so.
For banks, the liquidity (https://www.investopedia.com/terms/l/liquidity.asp) gap can change over the course of the day as deposits and withdrawals (https://www.investopedia.com/terms/w/withdrawal.asp) are made. This means that the liquidity gap is more of a quick snapshot of a firm's risk, rather than a figure that can be worked over for a long period of time. To compare periods of time banks, calculate the marginal gap, which is the difference between gaps of different periods.
During the early months of the global financial crisis (https://www.investopedia.com/terms/f/financial-crisis.asp), some bond and structured product investors found they could not sell their investments. There was a liquidity gap in that there weren't parties that were willing to take the other side of the trade and purchase the securities at depressed prices. This lack of liquidity caused markets in some securities to dry up for several weeks.
  • #1,425
  • May 11, 2019 10:46pm May 11, 2019 10:46pm
Quoting skyway
Precision means a lot of different things to different folks with different levels of appreciation. This is what I have in mind when I first propose the possibility of proper calibration - sort of a heatmap. This pic is from last Friday GJ intraday m15 price action. Sorry, not sharing. {image}
@skyway -- I don't understand. What do you mean by "the possibility of proper calibration -- sort of a heatmap". I know what a heatmap is when analyzing an RF spectrum trace -- but I don't know what it is in the context of a forex price chart. And what is being calibrated?
  • #1,426
  • May 11, 2019 11:19pm May 11, 2019 11:19pm
Quoting bluesteele
Just some.random Saturday thoughts on Gaps........ There's no comparison between trading traditional Gaps and "Hidden" gaps.. I've traded ALOT of weekend gaps quite successfully over many years......but also have been bitten hard on them years ago ... Now I tend to shy away from those types of gaps... The "hidden" liquidity gaps are new to me. George enlightened me to them...to say the least. They are now a big part of my trading and to be quite frank are a very very high probability trade setup ...combined with other filters.. Hundreds of...
@Bluesteele -- just so I get the terminology straight. By "traditional gaps" do you mean "price gaps" -- i.e. when there is a blank space between the previous close and next open? And by "hidden gaps" these are the liquidity gaps we've been talking about the past day or so, is that right?

I get that hidden or liquidity gaps occur when there are unfilled orders that remain to be transacted.

What is the underlying basis of a "price gap"? Since these do not necessarily get filled then I assume they don't represent unfilled orders. Does a price gap reflect a true change in a currency's value -- e.g. due to some economic or political event? Or do you also consider them another one of the MM's manipulations and, if so, how does the MM benefit?

Thanks...
  • #1,427
  • May 11, 2019 11:30pm May 11, 2019 11:30pm
Quoting skyway
{quote} There are 3 separate segments to analyse a price chart. 1. Direction, 2. momentum, 3. level. "MM psychology manipulation" is mostly addressing price levels, point 3. When I refer to proper calibration, you have to relate levels to direction and momentum for it to be meaningful and complete by way of calibration. This current liquidity gap and your earlier MM detective indis only mark some of the levels of interest. Imagine this can be done for all timeframes giving the macro as well as the micro perspective. This is that much info I am willing...
@skyway -- nice post -- thanks.

I keep some things proprietary -- both here (e.g. not sharing source code) and also with my business. So, I respect the line between what people are willing to share publicly and what they prefer not to share.

The direction, momentum and level you refer to are a nice way of breaking down a price chart. MM manipulation certainly affects price. As to whether or not it also addresses direction -- from what I've seen so far I'd say that it sometimes does (e.g. filling a liquidity gap) and sometimes doesn't (e.g. when you're not sure which target level will be taken out next). This is all good stuff. Slowly, slowly more and more seems to be coming together...
  • #1,428
  • May 12, 2019 12:39am May 12, 2019 12:39am
ice work Brother.
From programming side, perhaps lines shading, measure, type choices will be extraordinary and furthermore one of a kind string names for that, so when de-init we could do explicit get out and not erase all articles in dynamic graph.
  • #1,429
  • May 12, 2019 1:17am May 12, 2019 1:17am
Quoting bluesteele
This is part of the reason why for example I have many entries and exits within a fraction of a pip of highs and lows.
So why "yes" at the green arrows and "no" at the red arrows?

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  • #1,430
  • May 12, 2019 1:34am May 12, 2019 1:34am
Quoting Hj72
{quote} So why "yes" at the green arrows and "no" at the red arrows? {image}
Well I dont know where I said i did not take trades at these Red arrows.. Perhaps you can point out
where I said I did not ?


For illustrative purposes I used a 15M chart to show a point. And to CHERRY PICK an EXAMPLE showing
the PRECISENESS OF THE MM .
BUT
I take all my entries off the 1M chart.... and not solely based on
these levels shown.

I also use the 1hr and 4hr in conjuction with 15M and 1M
there are many filters involved,,Read Georges thread is my best advice to you.

Again ADR Time and Balance are major factors in deciding in what levels or gaps are traded.
Momentum and Balance of price. ALL CORRELATED with the 1HR and 4HR

Perhaps if you understood what these filters are then you would see.

But you can read what you want into it.. Not a problem its all part of the learning process.
Appreciate the question...

Cheers
Blue
Master your Mind,,,Master the Market
  • #1,431
  • Edited 3:44am May 12, 2019 2:54am | Edited 3:44am
Quoting robots4me
{quote} @TopCover -- very, very cool. Has anyone tried overlaying the WideRangeBar indicator on top of the MMDetective indicator to check if / how gaps and target levels align and whether you can tie it into MM psychology? If nothing else, it makes for a pretty picture and sure to impress you friends at the next cocktail party... {image}
Another Dejavu for me, Bro @Robots4me, we discuss this WRB-HiddenGap years ago in another trading platform (TradeStation) even they have commercial training on this..lol. Just googling WRB-HiddenGap, then later it will connecting to Auction Market Theory, etc..etc That also discuss here in FF with senior FF members like KG, Bandung, etc. But it's really nice that we re-discuss this again here, coz we should never stop learning.

If you search on MQL Community, you will find this indicator both for MT4 and MT5 updated in 2016 while the original created in 2008. So this is an old indicator.

Quoting robots4me
{quote} @skyway -- I don't understand. What do you mean by "the possibility of proper calibration -- sort of a heatmap". I know what a heatmap is when analyzing an RF spectrum trace -- but I don't know what it is in the context of a forex price chart. And what is being calibrated?
this chart from @HiddenGap from 2011 WRB discussion, and example of heatmap indicator

Attached Image


and the term Wide Range Bars, represent old term, because western world use bar charts instead of candlestick charts, before Steve Nisson introducing the Japanese Candlestick chart to the western world.

Wish You All The Best and keep smiling.
NIH
Dog + Smile = Beautiful Day
  • #1,432
  • May 12, 2019 2:54am May 12, 2019 2:54am
Quoting bluesteele
Well I dont know where I said i did not take trades at these Red arrows..
You didn't

But the two I marked in green were on your chart, and the two I marked in red were not (among others) and I was curious why.

Thanks for your reply!
  • #1,433
  • May 12, 2019 4:05am May 12, 2019 4:05am
Quoting Nih98
{quote} Another Dejavu for me, Bro @Robots4me, we discuss this WRB-HiddenGap years ago in another trading platform (TradeStation) even they have commercial training on this..lol. Just googling WRB-HiddenGap, then later it will connecting to Auction Market Theory, etc..etc That also discuss here in FF with senior FF members like KG, Bandung, etc. But it's really nice that we re-discuss this again here, coz we should never stop learning. If you search on MQL Community, you will find this indicator both for MT4 and MT5 updated in 2016 while the original...
@Nih98 -- amazing. You are like a forex encyclopedia

Again -- thank you for your help.
  • #1,434
  • May 12, 2019 4:16am May 12, 2019 4:16am
Quoting skyway
{quote} In due time, you may begin to understand why Nih is my master trader.
@skyway -- no need for due time. I realized that the first time I read one of his posts.
  • #1,435
  • May 12, 2019 4:49am May 12, 2019 4:49am
Quoting skyway
{quote} You are correct about this uncertainty in your observation. This suggest there has to be more than just mm manipulation which I refer to as incomplete.
@skyway -- the fact that I, @robots4me, is uncertain about something means nothing. Surely you would agree that experience (or lack of it) might have more to do with my uncertainty than any methodology. That does not suggest there has to be more than just MM manipulation. Rather, it suggests that @robots4me is a rookie.

But let's say I'm not alone in my uncertainty -- this could also be part of the manipulation. Luring traders with target levels that many interpret as "support" / "resistance" gets traders both coming and going. Perhaps I'm now ahead of most -- that is, my uncertainty may actually reflect a better understanding of MM psychology than traders who fall for the support / resistance trap.

For now I avoid those areas where I'm uncertain because I now see them as part of the MM's lure. More experienced traders like @RickM, @Nih98 and yourself are comfortable trading them.

@moodybot has mentioned a few times about "waiting for the MM to show its hand". The MM pokes its head out from the TMA and then re-enters. That is mostly what I look for these days. That type of move includes all 3 of the elements you mentioned: direction, momentum and level.

And now that liquidity gaps have been thrown into the mix, my repertoire (that's French, by the way) of potential Entries has doubled. Due to my inexperience, I much prefer looking for obvious, visual entries -- rather than more subtle ones that require "filters" and lots of discretionary decision making.

So -- nothing you've said or shown yet precludes MM manipulation is at play.
  • #1,436
  • May 12, 2019 5:01am May 12, 2019 5:01am
Quoting bluesteele
{quote} Well I dont know where I said i did not take trades at these Red arrows.. Perhaps you can point out where I said I did not ? For illustrative purposes I used a 15M chart to show a point. And to CHERRY PICK an EXAMPLE showing the PRECISENESS OF THE MM . BUT I take all my entries off the 1M chart.... and not solely based on these levels shown. I also use the 1hr and 4hr in conjuction with 15M and 1M there are many filters involved,,Read Georges thread is my best advice to you. Again ADR Time and Balance are major factors in deciding in what...
@Bluesteele -- thanks for your post.

I'm hoping you could elaborate a bit more on something you've mentioned before -- the use of "filters".

To me, a filter is an "indicator" -- i.e. an external computation performed by software to help highlight some aspect(s) of a price chart. You mention ADR, momentum, balance and many more. Yet you've also posted that indicators are useless.

Ques #1: How do the filters you refer to differ from the indicators I'm familiar with?

Ques #2: Of the filters you (and others) have mentioned, momentum is the most familiar to me. In fact, MT4 includes a default momentum indicator.

Is this the type of momentum you use as a filter, or are there more sophisticated ways to monitor momentum?

Thanks...
  • #1,437
  • May 12, 2019 5:58am May 12, 2019 5:58am
Quoting robots4me
{quote} ... In fact, MT4 includes a default momentum indicator. Is this the type of momentum you use as a filter, or are there more sophisticated ways to monitor momentum? Thanks...
Please see this link. https://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?p=12214637#post12214637
George is using SMA 7, 20 and 200 for momentum. A couple of posters asked how he uses these MAs for momentum and he said "too long to type".

I also asked the same question here https://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?p=12250211#post12250211 to moody, he either did not read the post or not to choose to answer.

Regards,
Blackeagle
  • #1,438
  • May 12, 2019 6:18am May 12, 2019 6:18am
Quoting robots4me
{quote}... the use of "filters". To me, a filter is an "indicator".......... Ques #1: How do the filters you refer to differ from the indicators I'm familiar with? ......
Please see the following link for some filters George uses.

https://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?p=12046556#post12046556

Regards,
Blackeagle
  • #1,439
  • May 12, 2019 6:42am May 12, 2019 6:42am
Quoting Blackeagle
{quote} Please see this link. https://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?p=12214637 George is using SMA 7, 20 and 200 for momentum. A couple of posters asked how he uses these MAs for momentum and he said "too long to type". I also asked the same question here https://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?p=12250211 to moody, he either did not read the post or not to choose to answer. Regards, Blackeagle

@Blackeagle -- thanks. I do recall SMA 7, 20, 200 -- I didn't realize that served as a momentum filter.

By the way -- using multiple SMAs this way is essentially the equivalent of using MTFs -- that is, they are like a "proxy" time frame. As an example, suppose I used SMA 10, 40 and 160 on an M15 chart. This is equivalent to using SMA 10 on M15, H1 and H4 charts. The SMA 40 and SMA 160 on the M15 chart serve as "proxy" time frames for H1 and H4 -- the advantage being I can see all 3 on one chart (M15).
  • #1,440
  • May 12, 2019 6:50am May 12, 2019 6:50am
Quoting Blackeagle
{quote} Please see the following link for some filters George uses. https://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?p=12046556#post12046556 Regards, Blackeagle
@Blackeagle -- thanks for the link. Yes, post #1184 in @George's "Price action at the core / tma intra day" has lots of good information.
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