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  • #681
  • Mar 11, 2010 1:45pm Mar 11, 2010 1:45pm
Well enough said for me to open my second account with MB trading instead of ATC who would be my choice if not for FXCM feed
  • #682
  • Mar 11, 2010 2:55pm Mar 11, 2010 2:55pm
Quoting Jason Rogers
I know the easy post to make the blanket statement that "X broker" is a market maker, and everyone is entitled to their opinion. Your timing is prescient since I just finished writing a detailed explanation of NDD execution for someone that asked me to explain on another forum (which I have provided below). You can also read a very concise overview of NDD execution in the FXCM US trading agreement as the NFA requires every broker to have. http://www.fxcm.com/docs_pdfs/trading_agreement.pdf Counterparty disclosure page 7. It outlines...
All this marketing hype looks very pretty, but in reality there is no benefit. Because it is either FXCM trading against me or the banks traders are trading against me. This is a zero sum game and for me to win somebody is got to lose. Let's take that a little furhter. Would I want to trade against FXCM's teenage analysts, as posted in the DailyFX, or would I want to fight against Bank of America, Citi or Deutch Bank? LOL. The choice is clear.
Let FXCM trade against me and don't gouge me on the spread on false pretenses.
  • #683
  • Mar 11, 2010 2:58pm Mar 11, 2010 2:58pm
Quoting sonicpunk32
Why not delay the switch to the bigger spreads on Micro until the day you actually switch to NDD?
Because they are manipulators...now they have this mobile trader which is free for standard accounts and you pay a per trade fee for micro...it is clear they want to stamp out the micros....they are like credit card companies...either always rasing the interest or adding fees, even if you were never late on a payment...the only solution is to dump them.
  • #684
  • Mar 11, 2010 5:26pm Mar 11, 2010 5:26pm
Well I am still enjoying MY micro account. Gone are the days of constant platform freezes(TS2 anyway). I dont scalp so an increase in Spreads(though NOT welcome!) will not alter my trading plan. I will have to transfer account to UK eventually(Jason do you have any idea when I WILL have to transfer or suffer the 10-1 change?). I like FXCM and their support and their TS2 platform.
FF = Forex Faggots
  • #685
  • Mar 11, 2010 6:20pm Mar 11, 2010 6:20pm
Quoting wwwin
All this marketing hype looks very pretty, but in reality there is no benefit. Because it is either FXCM trading against me or the banks traders are trading against me. This is a zero sum game and for me to win somebody is got to lose. Let's take that a little furhter. Would I want to trade against FXCM's teenage analysts, as posted in the DailyFX, or would I want to fight against Bank of America, Citi or Deutch Bank? LOL. The choice is clear.
Let FXCM trade against me and don't gouge me on the spread on false pretenses.
Well said. There is another thread going in the brokers section about another STP/NDD broker located outside the USA. It looks like most of the posters there don't seem to understand that it is all hype regarding this STP/NDD and at the end of the day us traders are always trading against a dealing desk located somewhere using all their tricks and manipulation. Disconnections and delayed executions are all part of dealing desks.
  • #686
  • Edited 8:07pm Mar 11, 2010 6:43pm | Edited 8:07pm
Quoting 8fingers
Well I am still enjoying MY micro account. Gone are the days of constant platform freezes(TS2 anyway). I dont scalp so an increase in Spreads(though NOT welcome!) will not alter my trading plan. I will have to transfer account to UK eventually(Jason do you have any idea when I WILL have to transfer or suffer the 10-1 change?). I like FXCM and their support and their TS2 platform.
If you only did 30 round trades a month of 1 standard contract it would cost you an extra $600 a month...not acceptable, especially since there is no benefit to this so called STP/NDD crap.
  • #687
  • Edited 7:24pm Mar 11, 2010 7:03pm | Edited 7:24pm
FX Capital Marketing a/k/a FXCM is getting better or at least these spreads...so they are adding at least 1.5 pip to arrive at their standard account rates of 2.3 pips for EU. No commission my arse...you are paying $230 per 1 million notional traded, ... others charge $20 per notional 1 million traded commision and 0.8 pip or less spread...that is a 1.2 spread including commssion. Basically they want the micros to pay about double the costs, without any live support or any other benefit. They are basically telling to the micros to go to hell.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
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  • #688
  • Mar 11, 2010 7:13pm Mar 11, 2010 7:13pm
Quoting wwwin
All this marketing hype looks very pretty, but in reality there is no benefit.
If this is all hype, then I must say, I've been falling for it for the past 6 months. So you're saying an NDD/STP is basically just a robot dealing desk that is just as vicious and malicious as a human dealing desk but more precise and robust? And this gives the broker legal power to proudly use phrases like "banks cant see your stops," "no conflict of interest between broker and trader," and such? If I was to become very profitable, why does FXCM say they will negotiate lower spreads? Do they enage in platform manipulation with your trades when one becomes profitable?

Can you provide a list of brokers you'd recommend that don't do this hype thing?
  • #689
  • Edited 7:52pm Mar 11, 2010 7:32pm | Edited 7:52pm
Quoting sonicpunk32
If this is all hype, then I must say, I've been falling for it for the past 6 months. So you're saying an NDD/STP is basically just a robot dealing desk that is just as vicious and malicious as a human dealing desk but more precise and robust? And this gives the broker legal power to proudly use phrases like "banks cant see your stops," "no conflict of interest between broker and trader," and such? If I was to become very profitable, why does FXCM say they will negotiate lower spreads? Do they enage in platform manipulation with your trades...
I have been testing FXDD PowerTrader since Monday, and so far it has been outstanding, the pic above is from the Powertrader currenex platform. To be fair to FXCM, I have no info on what they do or don't do to traders' account, I was generally happy with them until they messed up their platform when FIFO no SL no Limit came out...still I stayed with them...I recently switched to their UK branch to get away from US insanity...and was generally happy...but now they feel entitled (b/c they can provide a foreign office, they are flexing their muscles)...well everyone has their limits and they exceeded what I am willing to put up with.

As far as the marketing hype, that is all it is, there is always a dealing desk, what's the difference if it is FXCM's or Citi? The crap about not knowing stop is just that, whoever is dealing has a pretty good idea where the stops are. And I will venture to say that a big bank knows better then an FXCM dealing desk where the price is going short term. So pick your poison.
  • #690
  • Mar 11, 2010 9:04pm Mar 11, 2010 9:04pm
Quoting wwwin
If you only did 30 round trades a month of 1 standard contract it would cost you an extra $600 a month...not acceptable, especially since there is no benefit to this so called STP/NDD crap.
You make a good point. This is not my main account(MBT has that one). I still like this type of account(we will see after the increased spreads take effect?). This type of account is ideal for beginners and low balance accounts(TS2) -IMO.
I am stickin with them so far though.
FF = Forex Faggots
  • #691
  • Edited 1:07am Mar 12, 2010 12:06am | Edited 1:07am
Quoting Jason Rogers
I know the easy post to make the blanket statement that "X broker" is a market maker, and everyone is entitled to their opinion....
What a waste of a reply Jason typical FXCM dribble.

You mark up the spread once you do this you're a market maker....... deal with it. (you change the quotes that come into you to pass onto your clients) (Market Maker)

some in this world can look past the marketing crap that spills out of your image machine.

This is a public form so i can make my opinion. MY OPINION IS FXCM IS NOTHING MORE THEN A SHARP MARKETING CAMPAIGN TO CHANGE THE IMAGE THEY HAD IN THE REEFCAP DAYS. Buyer beware they mark up spreads and widen them at news, at their descesion...... and claim they are not a market maker... what a sales pitch..... bluff bluff bluff..

to see JasonRogers (FXCM) shot down have a look at this link. it's a thread from another form.... I advise anyone trading with FXCM or thinking about it to read the whole thread... really shows that they're just marketing spin IMO.

Active trader is a little different.... but the comms are way to expensive, up to the individual to choose. I am referring to the Marketing genius of STP NDD...CRAP!

refer to TraderNumber7 posts.

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/fore...iscussion.html

cheers
  • #692
  • Mar 12, 2010 5:18am Mar 12, 2010 5:18am
Quoting >Apocalypto<
Active trader is a little different.... but the comms are way to expensive, up to the individual to choose. I am referring to the Marketing genius of STP NDD...CRAP!
I've seen the Active Trader in action.
Very often spreads jump to 3-5 pip spreads on the majors even when other ECN od DMA broker have normal spreads from 0.3 - 0.8

Looks like price manipulation or they have very poor banks conneted to their ECN platform which is BTW a flash trading platform.

Spreads are on many pairs bad - the yen and pairs, USD/CAD AUD/USD NZD/USD and especially GBP/JPY

The commission is not competitive.
Everything above $17 per M is too expensive and unattractive.
  • #693
  • Mar 12, 2010 6:31am Mar 12, 2010 6:31am
Quoting PipStar
Well said. There is another thread going in the brokers section about another STP/NDD broker located outside the USA. It looks like most of the posters there don't seem to understand that it is all hype regarding this STP/NDD and at the end of the day us traders are always trading against a dealing desk located somewhere using all their tricks and manipulation. Disconnections and delayed executions are all part of dealing desks.
There's a big difference between trading directly against one market maker, your broker, and trading anonymously against multiple.

With a dealing desk you can get re-quotes, order restrictions, and intervention because your broker can see exactly what you're doing. They're taking the other side of the trade, and when push comes to shove, their profitability trumps your trading because their end goal as a business is to make a profit.

On NDD, you trade against 10 separate banks, and you're anonymous. That's why you can scalp without re-quotes or order restrictions. Your profit or loss doesn't impact FXCM's bottom line because we earn the pip mark-up regardless of the outcome of your trade so we're neutral.

It'll be hard to convince anyone who has experienced the frustration of being requoted constantly during trading that this is simply hype.
  • #694
  • Mar 12, 2010 6:45am Mar 12, 2010 6:45am
Quoting >Apocalypto<
What a waste of a reply Jason typical FXCM dribble.

You mark up the spread once you do this you're a market maker....... deal with it. (you change the quotes that come into you to pass onto your clients) (Market Maker)

some in this world can look past the marketing crap that spills out of your image machine.

This is a public form so i can make my opinion. MY OPINION IS FXCM IS NOTHING MORE THEN A SHARP MARKETING CAMPAIGN...
It is an interesting thread on Trade2Win since the poster seems to think FXCM UK is non-existent and that we have fixed spreads on our forex trading, to mention a few inaccuracies that seem to be ignored. The tactic of throwing a lot of mud and hoping something sticks is taken.

A market maker makes a market. They create the prices prices and provide the liquidity at the price they are quoting. Adding a pip-markup or commission, whichever is chosen, does not create a market maker. If you believe this to be the case then your idea of a market maker is incorrect. Wikipedia has a thorough definition http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Market_maker .
  • #695
  • Mar 12, 2010 6:52am Mar 12, 2010 6:52am
Quoting Jason Rogers
It is an interesting thread on Trade2Win since the poster seems to think FXCM UK is non-existent and that we have fixed spreads on our forex trading, to mention a few inaccuracies that seem to be ignored. The tactic of throwing a lot of mud and hoping something sticks is taken.
nice try JR, poor, but a good try..... why the attempt to destroy the credibility of that poster?

Quote
A market maker makes a market. They create the prices prices and provide the liquidity at the price they are quoting. Adding a pip-markup or commission, whichever is chosen, does not create a market maker. If you believe this to be the case then your idea of a market maker is incorrect. Wikipedia has a thorough definition http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Market_maker .
again you deny reality.... I am always incorrect ...... yeh sure am..... you get a price you change the price and you give it to a client. I can just imagine what goes on at news time... funny thing that Interactive Brokers spreads never really go out that far... not to the extent I have seen your demos go out to..... hmmmm make me wonder... I though you had the ten massive banks fighting with each other to give you the best quotes.......yeh right.

spin it how u want you make a price and pass it on...... hooded under the marketing non DD STP.... whatever.... it's OK i know you will never admit to it but newbies on this form need to think about that before they trade with you.

again refer to this thread and have a good read.... ther're mile wide holes in JRs arguments to Trader7

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/fore...iscussion.html

have a nice weekend in spin land champ.
  • #696
  • Mar 12, 2010 7:09am Mar 12, 2010 7:09am
Quoting Jason Rogers

With a dealing desk you can get re-quotes, order restrictions, and intervention because your broker can see exactly what you're doing. They're taking the other side of the trade, and when push comes to shove, their profitability trumps your trading because their end goal as a business is to make a profit.
.
The above statement is NOT true, if you set the trading mode to at BEST you do not get re-quotes. You only get re-quotes if you set it at MARKET RANGE.
This is why I am so upset at FXCM, they think all the traders are stupid. I feel for you Jason, you have a tough job trying to sell this corporate bullshit.

Also is it not the end job of a STP/NDD ALSO to make a profit??? LOL. Bullshit
  • #697
  • Mar 12, 2010 7:11am Mar 12, 2010 7:11am
Quoting >Apocalypto<
again you deny reality.... I am always incorrect ...... yeh sure am..... you get a price you change the price and you give it to a client.
If this is the case, then you've made up your own definition for a market maker.

Quote
why the attempt to destroy the credibility of that poster?

I'll point out inaccuracies. If it hurts the posters credibility, then correct and verifiable information should have been used to back up the argument. I don't think making things up should count as fact.
  • #698
  • Mar 12, 2010 7:17am Mar 12, 2010 7:17am
Quoting Jason Rogers
If this is the case, then you've made up your own definition for a market maker.


I'll point out inaccuracies. If it hurts the posters credibility, then correct and verifiable information should have been used to back up the argument. I don't think making things up should count as fact.
Hey Jason, posting inaccuracies works both ways...so don't post inaccuracies yourself please.

I will say it again, your statement on re-quotes is NOT true, if you set the trading mode to at BEST you do not get re-quotes. You only get re-quotes if you set it at MARKET RANGE.
  • #699
  • Mar 12, 2010 7:21am Mar 12, 2010 7:21am
To be fair to fxcm, these few people are not happy with fxcm for some reasons, but not the reasons posted here.

Even you are trading multi 10 lots, you can still use "market maker" spread that has commission built in. Its those company that charges commission's marketing tactic, believe or not.

No need to explain anymore if the trust if is not there for whatever reasons.

peace out.
  • #700
  • Mar 12, 2010 7:25am Mar 12, 2010 7:25am
Quoting Jason Rogers
If this is the case, then you've made up your own definition for a market maker.
ok then I have made it up..... the fact is you have 10 massive banks working non stop to give little old FXCM the best prices out there...bullshit, your daily volume would be a pittance in the deep liquidity section of the interbank.....

so I am wrong on what a market maker is, but you do take prices from where ever you get them mark them up and pass them on. what a deal... the client has no idea to the actual price you get is to what you market it up and pass it on as..... great deal there NOT! it's as transparent as a pool of muddy water..... so you come up with the marketing genius of NON DD STP well done marketing department of FXCM! clap clap.

Quote
I'll point out inaccuracies. If it hurts the posters credibility, then correct and verifiable information should have been used to back up the argument. I don't think making things up should count as fact.

LOL so will I am any other trader that see though the marketing campaign you have running.

Trader7 really pointed out some massive holes in your pitch JR. I picked it up right away as I have had lot of time talking with an ex interbank trader and what trader 7 spoke about is what I heard from him...... you and others under the JR user name have a great knack or posting mile long dribble that goes around in circles and get the poster off coarse....

I would say your credibility is at risk here not ours as we're not flogging anything.

again readers do your self a favor and read over this thread.

Trader7 makes some excellent points based on what i would say a career or many years as an interbank trader. JR does his best to muddle it up but the info in there is excellent.

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/fore...iscussion.html
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