Menu
Sister Sites

Options

Bookmark Thread

First Page First Unread Last Page Last Post

Print Thread

Attachments: XXXX
Exit Attachments

XXXX

Hm personally I've never done this I once read about a trader ( on this forum) who despite a long run of profitable trading blew his account after the market gapped against his position over the weekend.

Problem is that if for example a meteorite smashed into any number of the market affecting structures on the earth over the weekend there's no way to avoid a massive gap. Substitute metiorite for any random variable that could happen on a weekend and it seems a no brainer to avoid exposure.

My philosophy has always been to close out on Friday and if still sure of your convictions on Monday buy or sell back in on the open price. I guess it's also a matter of leverage.

In reality we could safely say that you'll likely be ok but trading is about the long run and any habits you develop will either bring you good luck or misfortune in the future, we create our own luck. If for example you get rewarded on Monday for a gap in your favor you will likely be more inclined to accept weekend exposure to any trades in the future, thus reenforcing a bad habit that could potentially be your downfall.

FOREX is risky enough as it is, why add any more risk to your long run performance than you need to? You will avoid paying the spread twice but seems a small price to pay for avoiding the potential risk you would other wise be exposed to.

That's just my view on it.
Time hides Nothing
  • Post #42
  • Quote
  • Edited 4:29pm Apr 1, 2012 1:20pm | Edited 4:29pm
Quoting CindyXXXX
Hm personally I've never done this I once read about a trader ( on this forum) who despite a long run of profitable trading blew his account after the market gapped against his position over the weekend.

Problem is that if for example a meteorite smashed into any number of the market affecting structures on the earth over the weekend there's no way to avoid a massive gap. Substitute metiorite for any random variable that could happen on a weekend and it seems a no brainer to avoid exposure.

My philosophy has always been to close out on Friday...
I agree with you cindy,

this is the second time though in the last few years I have left open one of my position's, the other time I was in a similar scenario,
Well in front with a high multiple R trade, I have closed a large % of the position already, leaving 0.25% on the table and running.

I regard one of my edges as my discipline so there's no worry of this weekend trade becoming a regular occurrence..Although I do think we need to be almost mechanical with our discretionary performance.

Talking of closing positions out going into the weekend ( the last 1 hr ), I have noticed the last few years, the large volatility going into the end of the US session before the weekend, where liquidity drops due to the unwinding of positions, price can often move a fair distance just before closing. A bit like what happens around NFP with its liquidity drops......

Scalpers paradise I would imagine.............

JA.
Memories caught in time but never forgotten
Quoting j4d
I agree with you cindy,

this is the second time though in the last few years I have left open one of my position's, the other time I was in a similar scenario,
Well in front with a high multiple R trade, I have closed a large % of the position already, leaving 0.25% on the table and running.

I regard one of my edges as my discipline so there's no worry of this weekend trade becoming a regular occurrence..Although I do think we need to be almost mechanical with our discretionary performance.

Talking of closing positions out going into the weekend...
Yes, it's often easy (dare I say) to capitalize on profit taking or exposure reduction leading up to important market events or news items as well.

How did the gap treat you BTW?
Time hides Nothing
Interestingly enough, my open position in GBPAUD gapped down -14 points
below the stop i had in place, when it re-opened.......

The broker filled the order at -9 points......


Ja.
Memories caught in time but never forgotten
  • Post #45
  • Quote
  • Edited 9:39am Apr 9, 2012 8:15am | Edited 9:39am
Hey cindy, patience

You guys seem like your a pair of munchers,lol, this curry helps to see the charts better...........
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Curry 1.jpg Size: 127 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: Curry 2.jpg Size: 139 KB
Memories caught in time but never forgotten
Chill down Patience I was only joking..

Can't handle the Pow Wow hey... haha... You wouldn't be the first... Def not the last

Thanks for the recepie too Ja... I'm on a diet at the moment actually... 4000 Calories a day...
Time hides Nothing
Hey Cindy,

A no bullshit question, What do you think an average return for a retail trader who is successful, my definition of successful is someone who has returned positive gains for more than 2 years..?

Hey Patience i would appreciate your view too, and anyone else who has there head on the right way round........ : )

I know there's no right and wrong here just interested....

My experience's, 20-30% ( if your lucky) a year in the current low volume, risk on,risk off environment, moving up to 30-40-50%+ in low volatile trending environments.....

Ja.
Memories caught in time but never forgotten
Quoting j4d
Hey Patience i would appreciate your view too, and anyone else who has there head on the right way round........ : )

I know there's no right and wrong here just interested....

My experience's, 20-30% ( if your lucky) a year in the current low volume, risk on,risk off environment, moving up to 30-40-50%+ in low volatile trending environments.....

Ja.
Well, Ja, I'm one of those useless gamblers on FF. I'm in my third year full-time. In 2010 I did around the 30% mark. I had hoped to improve on that in 2011 but I went to NZ for three months and was tripping all over the place so it ended up around 25% or something. I'm not exactly sure of the correct percentage because I withdrew/deposited and withdrew/deposited etc and I know you blokes are really into stats but the monetary value of my profit for 2011 ended up pretty much the same as 2010.

Doesn't sound a lot compared to some of the superstars around here does it? But if I make 20% this year on what is in my account, then that will be just fine. I don't live a lavish lifestyle and I don't have a mortgage.

I don't really want to go into monetary figures but I'm not trading with peanuts and my main problem is that I have a problem trading large. Not sure if it is a female thing or not but I'm still working on trusting my analysis enough to up the ante although you might have noticed that I would rather trade smaller and have a laugh while I am doing it

After all, money isn't everything, is it ....

P.S. I'm not talking to Cindy because he is in the boring box until further notice.
Nothing worth having is easy.
Quoting Patience
you might have noticed that I would rather trade smaller and have a laugh while I am doing it
.
//----

hey miss p...... ...... i second that emotion......

btw, have ya noticed that the tough big trade guys seem to laugh less.....

wonder why that is......h
to trade and code, keep both simple... no call to impress....h
  • Post #50
  • Quote
  • Edited 4:32pm Apr 10, 2012 11:28am | Edited 4:32pm
Quoting Patience
Well, Ja, I'm one of those useless gamblers on FF. I'm in my third year full-time. In 2010 I did around the 30% mark. I had hoped to improve on that in 2011 but I went to NZ for three months and was tripping all over the place so it ended up around 25% or something. I'm not exactly sure of the correct percentage because I withdrew/deposited and withdrew/deposited etc and I know you blokes are really into stats but the monetary value of my profit for 2011 ended up pretty much the same as 2010.

Doesn't sound a lot compared to some of the superstars...

Hey Patience,

For years I used to "sift" through the threads here vowing never to register because of some the "drivel" that is written in these walls,
Hidden amongst a lot of crap though is some real pearls of wisdom, traders that when they write something you can relate to it, these guys and girls are what makes these types forums worth while...

I would hasten to add, the odd bit of "banter" that goes on here, which is nothing to do with trading is also very welcome..................(more so sometimes).

I keep reading of traders who say they return 10% a week, a day etc etc, and I'm afraid I have fallen for the trap (idiot) and started to reply to some of these comments, questioning there authenticity (double idiot lol). I have allowed myself to be sucked in to the "drivel" that paints the walls here in the forum. As if I didnt now better..lol (treble idiot..lol..lol), not any-more though I have learnt my lesson.

Your answer is very refreshing patients and hayseed, we are on the same field with our views......

You know the most important thing to all this though, as said so gracefully by yourself..........After all, money isn't everything, is it ....

You have a good day..................JA
Memories caught in time but never forgotten
Hey J4,

I honestly think you are only limited by your own beliefs. I think it's a personal thing as well. 30% to you might be 400% to me, trading styles also differ.

Everyone has their own goals ambitions, risk tolerance, account size, time frames, etc etc. I think a trader is only as good as his last trade myself. And I guess 2 years consistent profits is more than enough to call yourself a winner. Success to one person might not be the same thing as success to someone else so again I think it's just a personal thing that will obviously be different for everyone.

Personally I target big % but I'm no cowboy. I risk just 1% per trade and target 10:1 - 20:1 r:r. Sometimes I'll be stopped out for 3:1 or a 5:1 but my main goal is to stay in long enough to get that 10 - 20:1.

I like your preferred trading strategy in your profile as well . Exactly what I do. Gotta know when to swing though (and when to stop swinging lol).

Time hides Nothing
Quoting hayseed
//----

hey miss p...... ...... i second that emotion......

btw, have ya noticed that the tough big trade guys seem to laugh less.....

wonder why that is......h
Big tough trade guys? .. .as they say... Only in America lol
Time hides Nothing
Quoting CindyXXXX
Hey J4,

I honestly think you are only limited by your own beliefs. I think it's a personal thing as well. 30% to you might be 400% to me, trading styles also differ.

Everyone has their own goals ambitions, risk tolerance, account size, time frames, etc etc. I think a trader is only as good as his last trade myself. And I guess 2 years consistent profits is more than enough to call yourself a winner. Success to one person might not be the same thing as success to someone else so again I think it's just a personal thing that will obviously be different...
Hey Cindy,

Thanks for your honest reply, I agree Without a doubt the way forward is those super tight 1 R stops with those large multiple R rewards.

I guess the dawn of a new day is in-front of you.......

Bed for me....

Have a good one............Ja
Memories caught in time but never forgotten
Quoting j4d
Hey Cindy,

Thanks for your honest reply, I agree Without a doubt the way forward is those super tight 1 R stops with those large multiple R rewards.

I guess the dawn of a new day is in-front of you.......

Bed for me....

Have a good one............Ja
Quite the contrary actually I used to trade much that way... Tight stops etc.. But I've since discovered the "secret" of scaling in progressively. Basically rewarding yourself for being right and staying in a trade at your risk. Basically backing your own judgement, I rarely go to break even anymore. I will always have 1% at risk until the time comes to start locking in profits. My first position usually has quite a big SL of anywhere from 30 - 60 pips usually in the upwards of that range... But the main focus is on controlling risk, whilst at the same time maximizing your chances of potentially huge rewards.

Sleep well
Time hides Nothing
Quoting hayseed
//----

hey miss p...... ...... i second that emotion......

btw, have ya noticed that the tough big trade guys seem to laugh less.....

wonder why that is......h
Yeah. Why can't they be more like you?

And nice to see you, as always.
Nothing worth having is easy.
Quoting j4d
I keep reading of traders who say they return 10% a week, a day etc etc, and I'm afraid I have fallen for the trap (idiot) and started to reply to some of these comments, questioning there authenticity (double idiot lol). I have allowed myself to be sucked in to the "drivel" that paints the walls here in the forum. As if I didnt now better..lol (treble idiot..lol..lol), not any-more though I have learnt my lesson.
Don't worry about it Ja. We've all been there .... once or twice ....

I know I'm not a great trader. Don't even like to call myself a trader to be honest but the word gambling/gambler winds people up on this forum so I try not to use it all the time.

You know, I get that it is easier to attain larger percentage gains on a smaller account because the psychological element doesn't kick in until a certain level and that level will be different for everyone. Kudos to those that have a robust enough system to rise above this issue. Unfortunately, I haven't got there, and I'm not sure I ever will so I just plod along doing what is comfortable for me. Do I have an edge? I don't know. Will I still be doing this in a few years' time? I don't know. But one thing I do know is that the market will definitely let me know.

I tried to address the psychological issue some time ago in a thread and I posted this chart of two of my accounts. I don't think I need to say any more

Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: small vs big.png Size: 24 KB


Oh, yeah, ignore the drawdown figures. They aren't correct.
Nothing worth having is easy.
Where is this thread going? Seems to be off course.
My first question is: What is your definition of system?

Mind would be:
System defined as your trading method, money management, and your rules.

OR are you meaning you'd like to make your discretionary method more mechanical?

One of the ways to make your entry more mechanical would be to break the entry down into it's parts. Your 'setup' and then your 'trigger'. MM can be mechanical by using something like %R. 2% on the trade, figure out the stop, calculate the size. I think the DIBS method is a pretty good at showing how you make as much of a discretionary method as mechanical as possible.

I'm sure I'm not telling you anything new, but that is what came to mind.
Don't wish it were easier, wish you were better. ~ Jim Rohn
  • Post #58
  • Quote
  • Edited 2:22pm Apr 11, 2012 9:01am | Edited 2:22pm
Quoting CindyXXXX
Quite the contrary actually I used to trade much that way... Tight stops etc.. But I've since discovered the "secret" of scaling in progressively. Basically rewarding yourself for being right and staying in a trade at your risk. Basically backing your own judgement, I rarely go to break even anymore. I will always have 1% at risk until the time comes to start locking in profits. My first position usually has quite a big SL of anywhere from 30 - 60 pips usually in the upwards of that range... But the main focus is on controlling risk, whilst at...
Hey Cindy,

Would you say then your initial exposure would be 1%, then scaling in with say 0.25%-0.50% type sizes, or larger ?, what would be your total exposure, or would that be determined by what you would be comfortable with in the trade enviroment..............

Do you ever get the feeling of ships passing in the night......................

Ja.
Memories caught in time but never forgotten
Quoting Patience
Don't worry about it Ja. We've all been there .... once or twice ....

I know I'm not a great trader. Don't even like to call myself a trader to be honest but the word gambling/gambler winds people up on this forum so I try not to use it all the time.

You know, I get that it is easier to attain larger percentage gains on a smaller account because the psychological element doesn't kick in until a certain level and that level will be different for everyone. Kudos to those that have a robust enough system to rise above this issue. Unfortunately,...
Hey Patients

You know, I get that it is easier to attain larger percentage gains on a smaller account because the psychological element doesn't kick in until a certain level and that level will be different for everyone.

cp

I Agree, that is really the issue, Cindy mentioned it as well, It all comes down to your comfort zone in trade size, your perception of comfort risk.

I'm really a risk averse kinda guy, most of my trades are 0.50% in size and I close half at a checkpoint, trailing with 0.25%. Occasionally when the environment dictates i will step up too 1% but only in a A+ situation..I do however trade a reasonable size account, so because of this it determines my risk.

I have been asked by friends and some colleagues if they can invest some money, indeed my mother is interested, As you know interest rates aren't so favourable for people retired living off there savings. I know, I know friends and family investing, it could turn out awkward, everyone involved though understands risk and all I have promised is I wont lose more than 20% of there investment. Now this brings us back to "comfort size" ( I promise I'm not starting to get x-rated..lol), How will I react with OPM, and a larger account, should I go ahead with this ( still mulling it over).....

Well time will tell if I can manage it.....................All I need is mind power, LOL...

Hey Patience, looking at your equity curves ( nice looking curves by the way, minimal draw-downs ) maybe you should just have a high risk and a low risk account. When the high risk account starts to feel outside your comfort size, take the excess out and place into your low risk account, start with your deposit again....

Ja.


Memories caught in time but never forgotten
Quoting Patience
You know, I get that it is easier to attain larger percentage gains on a smaller account because the psychological element doesn't kick in until a certain level and that level will be different for everyone. .
//---

hey miss p..... this is very true.... something which can be verified watching real accounts at ibfx connect.... a sub 500$ account is usually at the top of the % list....

hmmm, your chart big vs small shows 1:50 leverage.... ha..... kinda dispells the gotta-have-big-leverage myth doesn't it......

you trade far larger lots than me, so this would be for the others readin this...... one way to pysch up into larger lots is to base them on account balance...... this way lots slowly millimeter up..... or down...... hardly noticeable......

//---

such as.....

Inserted Code
 
   double suggestlots = NormalizeDouble((AccountBalance()*0.01)/(MarketInfo(Symbol(),MODE_TICKVALUE)*dayatr),2);

//---

cindy mentioned 'only in america'..... ever noticed how many contients start and end with a...... we must have somethin in common......

in any event, all us little women need to stick together......h
to trade and code, keep both simple... no call to impress....h
0 traders viewing now