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-   -   Symphonie Trader System (https://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?t=315572)

Kasapreko Oct 27, 2011 3:42pm | Post# 1941

Hello Evaluator,

i'm following your thread since beginning and your contribution to this community here is great.

I'd like to clarify some things with my best non-native english i could do.
The problem don't lie in the repainting issue with the extreme cycle indie. I think the frustration comes, because of chartrefreshing, MT4 restarting and that some have another cycles than other. This lies in bad programming with this indicator. And, yes i know, that this system is in symphonie with 4 indicators, but the extreme cycle indicator gives us the...
Mediator just explained it.
You cant be gunning for a sell with this system and because the extreme indicator disappears you start looking for a buy. I asked this question earlier "do you we use yesterday's extreme to trade today"s signal when the 3 other indicators line up?"

This system or method has potential but there needs to be some filtering like following the trend on the higher time frame(that's if its possible,and I feel one or two observers here are doing it but just keeping quiet) We dont need extra indicators and what not or we will never be in a trade or be too late.
Please can some one talk!?

Kasapreko

bullzeye Oct 27, 2011 4:53pm | Post# 1942

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Hey Guys,

i missed the whole action today, came a few minutes ago to my desk

so i will show you the way how i handle the problem with the repainting spike:

there a small trade that i take, look on the chart

-all 4 indis on the way to sell-->entry
-extrem spike appears, exit after a few pips profit
- then set a pending sell order, if the price go lower you will take the possible trend down and the spike will disappear, if not you are on the safe way, stay on the sideline and waiting another signal

Keep cool

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Geges Oct 27, 2011 5:02pm | Post# 1943

Just an idea on 30 minute chart
 
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1= Blue bottom spike
2= Blue sentiment
3= Blue market emotion
4= Green arrow is 5 period 8 period ma cross indicator

White elipse show price still consolidate in 34 period wave range

5= Trendline Blue and candle close above 34 period wave range

I did not trade this but my idea would be to place a buy stop order
1 pip above the HIGH of that candle for a method for entry and then follow the rest of rules of method from page 1

G

Ill try to follow up with another chart if the Short thats forming comes to fruition

Evaluator Oct 27, 2011 5:03pm | Post# 1944

Hello Evaluator,

i'm following your thread since beginning and your contribution to this community here is great.

I'd like to clarify some things with my best non-native english i could do.
The problem don't lie in the repainting issue with the extreme cycle indie. I think the frustration comes, because of chartrefreshing, MT4 restarting and that some have another cycles than other. This lies in bad programming with this indicator. And, yes i know, that this system is in symphonie with 4 indicators, but the extreme cycle indicator gives us the...
Mediator,

The system will not be 100% right all the time and if that is what you are looking for that you will not find it with this system. Also, please understand that this is not just about indikators there are 2 part of the Symphonie System. The first part is technical it is the indkiators themselves but the second part is you and your trading habits, chart identifications, ARS and proper money management.

Yes, the indikators repaint. Yes, you will need to refresh. Yes, there will be instances that the signals will not be 100% correct. That is always a problem with indikators that are forward looking. It is just the nature of the indikators programming. Several people have looked at the code and all have said the same thing. ''it cannot be changed or else it will not work''

So, you will have to either live with the fact it repaints or continue your journey for another system that suits your trading style.

The Symphonie Trader System is design to help you develop trade consistancy and help to train you what to do when the markets become totally unpredictable and beable to interpret those conditions in such a way that you will profit. The purpose is to help you identify price action movements in a way that you will make more winning trades than loosing trades. To maximize your profit potential while minimizing your losses on bad trades.

Evaluator.

Evaluator Oct 27, 2011 5:16pm | Post# 1945

Mediator just explained it.
You cant be gunning for a sell with this system and because the extreme indicator disappears you start looking for a buy. I asked this question earlier "do you we use yesterday's extreme to trade today"s signal when the 3 other indicators line up?"

This system or method has potential but there needs to be some filtering like following the trend on the higher time frame(that's if its possible,and I feel one or two observers here are doing it but just keeping quiet) We dont need extra indicators and what not or we will...
Kasapreko,

As I told Mediator;

Yes, the indikators repaint. Yes, you will need to refresh. Yes, there will be instances that the signals will not be 100% correct. That is always a problem with indikators that are forward looking. It is just the nature of the indikators programming. Several people have looked at the code and all have said the same thing. ''it cannot be changed or else it will not work''
If you think you can fix the problem then please take a shot at it and see what you can do. Many people, if you re-read the thread, have and still are trying to solve the issues you are complain about. No one has succeeded so far.

As to when should you take a trade?? You should take a trade when the systems signals you to take a trade. What should you do if it repaint...? As I stated before take it like you would take a normal new signal and action on that fact.

This system will never be 100% perfect and I do not expect it to be 100% perfect. I do expect it to provide you with more winning trades than lossing ones and if you use the Seccond part of the System (i.e. ARS and money management) I think you will find your trading impoves and your account balance will reflect it.

I am not hiding anything and I think I have been very open about Symphonie, how it functions, and what it can do. Re read this thread if you wish proof.

As I have told many others, this system is not for everyone and if Symphonie does not meet the level of Satisfaction then I am sure there are many others on this thread to choose from.

Evaluator.

wycfitz Oct 27, 2011 5:39pm | Post# 1946

I just ran across this thread yesterday and studied up on how to use these indicators. I think they do a pretty good job! To just start using a new trading system and make money on it right away I have no complaints at all. Sure you need to refresh the charts, but you need to click to place an order also. I don't see what is the big deal works Great thanks Evaluator!

Mediator Oct 27, 2011 6:00pm | Post# 1947

Hello Evaluator,

I'm sorry if my post sounded bad. This was not my intention.
And if you read my post you would have recogniced that not the repainting is the issue.
What makes me irritating is the fact to switch every candle forth and back between timeframes. And this is not a general problem with forward looking indicators. This is a problem especialy with this indicator. But hey no problem, i'm a professional coder and earlier or later i will find a fix.

And i also really know that there is no ever system outside which produces 100% winning signals. I'm trading long enough to know this. But i like to trade intraday whilst i stack orders with my positiontrading-system. Your system fits the best now.

You don't have to proof. I never asked. But if you like you could link your account with myfxbook.com and we could follow your decisions, compare them with our own charts or compare with other persons results with other timeframes. So no signalposting is needed.

May i ask if you fit your breakeven and/or stoploss with the currensypairs volatility?

Shaking hands and a good business.

Mediator

Kasapreko Oct 27, 2011 6:18pm | Post# 1948

Kasapreko,

As I told Mediator;

If you think you can fix the problem then please take a shot at it and see what you can do. Many people, if you re-read the thread, have and still are trying to solve the issues you are complain about. No one has succeeded so far.

As to when should you take a trade?? You should take a trade when the systems signals you to take a trade. What should you do if it repaint...? As I stated before take it like you would take a normal new signal and action on that fact.

This system will never be 100% perfect and...
Evaluator,kudos to you and the way you go about your thread,but I don't think you understood what I wrote before you replied me. If I am following Symphonie rules exactly,there will be no where it will tell me to place a buy trade today on eur/usd 5mins chart,and you just said something like if the sell spike disappears we can place a buy trade (I asked earlier if we could use yesterday's spike to line with today's indicators and take a trade?)

The other thing is that I noticed you make your decisions with other things;as you said,you are into elliot wave and that is for some serious pros,and most people here aren't . Evaluator,lots of people have been burnt in this mkt,and people will find salvation in the nearest thing,person or soft-wear that looks like the savior so that's why people can be sensitive and ask one or two questions that might tick you,but I noticed you have been very patient,but still you don't have to tell someone if he or she dont like it to go somewhere else...how did you feel when you blew your first account? me I felt alone in this world and if someone came to me that minute and told me he had a solution to my trading,I would have jumped straight in. What I'm saying is that your system looks very good and promising and people have seen your equity curve and you update them;they feel very close to what they have been looking and wanting all their trading lives,and for them to get disappointed at the end,its like offering someone that hasn't eaten for 3days a big cheese bugger and coke and as he is about to have a bite you take it away,it can destroy mentally.
I just want you to understand and be more patient with fx people....we are all crazy
lots of love man

Kasapreko

realjumper Oct 27, 2011 7:21pm | Post# 1949

I've said this before, and I'll say it again.....this system is not the holy grail....that system does not exist.

To use this system properly, you need to be able to apply some BASIC technical analysis, as well as some BASIC common sense. For the basics of technical analysis, please go to babypips.com

It cannot possibly have escaped peoples notice that since Asian open yesterday, we were in a very strong bull run......and this is due to the good EU news. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that as each market opens, they too will react in the same way to the news. We saw it with London open and it's no surprise that we saw it again with USA open.

Why, why, why were some of you trying to sell into an OBVIOUS bull run????? There were numerous opportunities to buy into this bull run. Every bull run (or bear run) will have pullbacks......very often these form flags, which are traps.......I've been through this a week or two ago. DO NOT trade the pullbacks......trade WITH the trend.....NOT against it.

Come on guys and girls.......use your head.....learn some basic technical analysis, candle formations (which can often hint at reversal points), learn something about pivots, fibs, s/r levels. You cannot simply download Evals system and expect IT to trade profitably for you. YOU need to do some homework too.

Does buying the best spanners and wrenches in the world turn you into an instant A Grade mechanic? Does buying a set of chisels and saws turn you into an instant carpenter?

Please......stop complaining about the system when mostly it is YOU who is letting the system down, not the other way around.

RJ

sneid Oct 27, 2011 7:24pm | Post# 1950

retrace or reverse
 
Hi guys and eval,

If one were to trade on M5 TF, how would one be able to recognise whether the current 4 indicators signal a sell in this case as a pullback (retrace) or a reverse? Its always confusing to recognise if this is a pullback or reverse at that point of time and many will just take trade as per signals say so, however when it reverse to continue the trend, I did not see the blue bottoming extreme spike on my laptop, but I can see it from my desktop with the same broker.

Although I did not take the trade but if i were to take the trade and sell, I would have sold on M5 based on all the 4 indications signal sell and would be stopped out for SL 50pips because my laptop did not show bottoming extreme spike. I use laptop is because I'm outside working and laptop is the next tool i can approach for trading then come home watch on desktop. So would there be a way to recognise if the current situation is a retrace or reverse?

This can happen in M15 TF as well also less frequent than M5 but can be costly issue than M5 as the SL is larger than M5 TF.

Hey Guys,

i missed the whole action today, came a few minutes ago to my desk

so i will show you the way how i handle the problem with the repainting spike:

there a small trade that i take, look on the chart

-all 4 indis on the way to sell-->entry
-extrem spike appears, exit after a few pips profit
- then set a pending sell order, if the price go lower you will take the possible trend down and the spike will disappear, if not you are on the safe way, stay on the sideline and waiting another signal

Keep cool

Attachment 817346

realjumper Oct 27, 2011 7:36pm | Post# 1951

Hi guys and eval,

If one were to trade on M5 TF, how would one be able to recognise whether the current 4 indicators signal a sell in this case as a pullback (retrace) or a reverse? .
You can usually tell by looking at various time frames. Sometimes a pullback might look genuine on the M5.......switch to the M15 and check again. If you are still unsure, check out an M30 or an H1 chart......one of these charts will either reveal the truth, or there might be enough doubt for you to think, 'hmmm......I'm not sure whether this is a reversal or a pullback'.

If you're not sure whether it is a reversal or a pull back.......why take a guess? What's wrong with just waiting until you get a clearer picture? Waiting won't cost you cent. Of course it is possible that you will miss a trade......so what??? The market is going to be there tomorrow you know!!

Buying and Selling are both positions. Keeping your money in your pocket until the picture becomes clear, is ALSO a position......and sometimes it's the best position!!

RJ

camvcvoo Oct 27, 2011 7:56pm | Post# 1952

You can usually tell by looking at various time frames. Sometimes a pullback might look genuine on the M5.......switch to the M15 and check again. If you are still unsure, check out an M30 or an H1 chart......one of these charts will either reveal the truth, or there might be enough doubt for you to think, 'hmmm......I'm not sure whether this is a reversal or a pullback'.

If you're not sure whether it is a reversal or a pull back.......why take a guess? What's wrong with just waiting until you get a clearer picture? Waiting won't cost you cent....
RJ, well said!

Boys and girls, every system requires you to develop two very important traits:

Patience and disciplines.

Besides a winning system which we already posses, these two are needed. As Vegas pointed out very long time ago in his documents:

"You do not need brains to make money in forex, you need patience and discipline."

"This is the hardest easy money you will ever make."

realjumper Oct 27, 2011 8:04pm | Post# 1953

RJ, well said!

Boys and girls, every system requires you to develop two very important traits:

Patience and disciplines.

Besides a winning system which we already posses, these two are needed. As Vegas pointed out very long time ago in his documents:

"You do not need brains to make money in forex, you need patience and discipline."

"This is the hardest easy money you will ever make."
Exactly......just because the trade station is open, and the market is moving, that doesn't mean that you HAVE to enter a trade. As I said, often the best position in keeping your money in your pocket!

Protecting your capital forms the basis of all MM.

I will post some technical analysis when I can, perhaps it will help people understand that it is a valuable part of trading. After you have spent time drawing lines etc etc all over your charts, you will (one day) have the EUREKA moment where you can glance at a chart and see things very clearly.

RJ

realjumper Oct 27, 2011 8:16pm | Post# 1954

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Here is the H4 of eur/usd. You can see that we have been in a nice steady bull run since October 4th (1). Look how that has accelerated (2) since the 27th...which is of course, yesterdays EU news.

How long do you think such a steep climb can continue?

Will there be a retrace (pullback) or a reversal?

If we zoom in on yesterdays action, there might be a hint for us.

Have a think about it and I'll post a zoomed in of this chart
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dynel14 Oct 27, 2011 8:19pm | Post# 1955

i've said this before, and i'll say it again.....this system is not the holy grail....that system does not exist.

To use this system properly, you need to be able to apply some basic technical analysis, as well as some basic common sense. For the basics of technical analysis, please go to babypips.com

it cannot possibly have escaped peoples notice that since asian open yesterday, we were in a very strong bull run......and this is due to the good eu news. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that...
Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!

realjumper Oct 27, 2011 8:26pm | Post# 1956

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When we zoom in on the same chart as above, what do we see? Immediately I see a candle that the buyers have tried to extend upwards, but the sellers have very obviously said "hell no", and pushed it back down again, leaving that long tail.

That is a shooting star......because it looks like a shooting star. What does it mean? Read all about it here

Does it mean that a reversal is going to happen?.......or a significant retrace is going to happen? It may do either of those.....or it may do neither. NOTHING is certain in FX. What it does signify though, it that caution should be exercised when considering going long around here........yes......I know it's an H4 chart.......and yes......you may well get a good 50 pips buy on the M5 chart.......but you have been warned!! Bear the warning in mind!

RJ

Edit.....wrong chart.....now corrected
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Jack Herer Oct 27, 2011 9:12pm | Post# 1957

When we zoom in on the same chart as above, what do we see? Immediately I see a candle that the buyers have tried to extend upwards, but the sellers have very obviously said "hell no", and pushed it back down again, leaving that long tail.

That is a shooting star......because it looks like a shooting star. What does it mean? Read all about it here

Does it mean that a reversal is going to happen?.......or a significant retrace is going to...
Great post.

As you already said, you cannot expect ANY system to do all the work for you. If this was even remotely possible, we would have EA's doing all the trading for us while drinking at the swimming pool and just counting money, lol.

People, pay attention to the basics of trading! Take a good look at pivots and obvious S&R, and how PA behaves around them.

I don't care if the systems tells me to sell, if it's RIGHT ABOVE a pre-hystorical suport zone, I will NOT short until support is broken. Same for longs, no way I'm taking a long right below resistance. It's almost never worth the risk.

that being said, I do have to notice that we broke through 1.4160, which in my charts is a strong area of S&R. This could pottentially hold for now. However, we just had a uptrend of 400+ pips in one DAY.

a retrace is not only expected but needed, very soon. Just wait.

realjumper Oct 27, 2011 9:35pm | Post# 1958

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Great post.

As you already said, you cannot expect ANY system to do all the work for you. If this was even remotely possible, we would have EA's doing all the trading for us while drinking at the swimming pool and just counting money, lol.

People, pay attention to the basics of trading! Take a good look at pivots and obvious S&R, and how PA behaves around them.

I don't care if the systems tells me to sell, if it's RIGHT ABOVE a pre-hystorical suport zone, I will NOT short until support is broken. Same for longs, no way I'm taking a long right...
Indeed Jack....indeed.

Here is a weekly chart showing some historic support/resistance levels. Of course there is a reasonable amount of flexibility here because the weekly is less precise (for our purposes) that the M5 or M 15 charts. But once again....it's something to bear in mind......
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realjumper Oct 27, 2011 10:00pm | Post# 1959

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I didn't take this counter trend trade because I was asleep. I know I just said about not trading against the trend, but the bull run is over for now as you would have seen if you read my past few posts.

This trade I would have considered taking, because all the signs were there. However, after such a profitable bull run, I doubt that I would bother in reality......no point in being greedy.

Regardless, this chart is interesting from a technical analysis point of view

1. Extreme Spike
2. Stochastic Falling
3. Red
4. Red
5. Red Arrow (Sell)
6. Shooting Star.........Bonus indication.

See how the shooting star absolutely confirmed the top? The top might only be short term, we don't know.....but it is good enough to confirm all the other indications that we have that say that a short here is a high probability trade.
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rivtrader Oct 27, 2011 10:28pm | Post# 1960

AudUsd Short
 
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Looking to see how trading Asia on the last day of the week would be like. Probably like watching paint dry.


Placed a very early BE +1 Stop and a 75 Pip target just above the 62% retracement area on the 4 hour chart and will let it run it's course.

Stop triggered for 1 pip.
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