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  • Brexit Poll Puts Leave Camp Ahead

    From marketpulse.com

    The Fed is having a tough time getting its own message across; you know the one that U.S rate normalization has begun. The Fed believes that market participants are caught behind the curve; by under pricing future Fed rate hikes. Later this morning, in this holiday shortened trading week, the market gets to chew on U.S inflation numbers. Perhaps today’s release may convince a few of the unconverted that when the Fed mentions a meeting is ‘live’ they may not just be paying lip service. Today’s release is important. Currently, with the U.S core inflation print already above the Fed’s desired target of +2%, ... (full story)

The vote will be rigged for no exit, regardless of the actual vote. Britain goes, and the EU will fall apart.
"The market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent"
  •  Guest
  • | IP XXX.XXX.234.43
Agreed, all of the talk features around the economic impact to UK, oddly enough nothing has been mentioned on euro side impact, we import quite a few things from Europe, unsure of exact figures but if it all goes the wrong way I'd love to see Deutsche bank implode or at least lose a few more trillion, as for food imports, the UK produces quite a bit which doesn't meet the euro measuring tape and so gets used as expensive fertilizer, we are the financial hub of Europe but at what cost? Maybe if euro planned mass housing in UK we wouldn't be in such a tight corner......
no brexit,..,
Quoting Guest
Agreed, all of the talk features around the economic impact to UK, oddly enough nothing has been mentioned on euro side impact, we import quite a few things from Europe, unsure of exact figures but if it all goes the wrong way I'd love to see Deutsche bank implode or at least lose a few more trillion, as for food imports, the UK produces quite a bit which doesn't meet the euro measuring tape and so gets used as expensive fertilizer, we are the financial hub of Europe but at what cost? Maybe if euro planned mass housing in UK we wouldn't be in such...

Where is all this anonymous lobbying by "guests" coming from?
Seems ANYBODY can post here.
Quoting anton.olff
The vote will be rigged for no exit ....
You are not the first person I have heard to say that.
Carbon-Dioxide: the gas of life!
  •  Guest
  • | IP XXX.XXX.96.242
GBP will gain more strength either way. A break away from EU or staying within EU, England will always be a strong partner.
  •  Guest
  • | IP XX.XX.221.152
That reference in the to the 55/45 Torygraph Remain lead is quite wrong and misleading...even the paper itself today says on front page 51/45...(I presume marketpulse is a signed up member of the Remain campaign too...)
I love the fact call me Dave got nothing solid he asked for only promises and obviously magic beans, yet wants to stay in!!
Quoting Guest
That reference in the to the 55/45 Torygraph Remain lead is quite wrong and misleading...even the paper itself today says on front page 51/45...(I presume marketpulse is a signed up member of the Remain campaign too...)
UK is going nowhere

http://sports.ladbrokes.com/sports-central/uk-eu-referendum/
Quoting Guest
as for food imports, the UK produces quite a bit which doesn't meet the euro measuring tape and so gets used as expensive fertilizer,
If Brexit happen be prepared to pay twice for all the fruit and veg, wine and the rest of lovely stuff that doesn't grow in this climate. it's back to canned spaghetti
UK people : What are your views on this vote. I am talking about the pros and cons that you can think of that will affect you in general.
When the going gets tough , the tough get going
Quoting Stubborn
UK people : What are your views on this vote. I am talking about the pros and cons that you can think of that will affect you in general.
700 million Turks will come !
Quoting cliffedwards
Where is all this anonymous lobbying by "guests" coming from?
Seems ANYBODY can post here.
Guess they are getting paid rather well for posting all that BS propaganda.

Quoting noiko jones
If Brexit happen be prepared to pay twice for all the fruit and veg, wine and the rest of lovely stuff that doesn't grow in this climate. it's back to canned spaghetti

Staple food as well, not only treats. One just needs to visit the nearest Tesco to find out, how little food is being produced in this country.


Quoting barkie
700 million Turks will come !
Not to mention Orcs, Goblins and ordinary cave trolls ;-)
  •  Guest
  • | IP XXX.XX.34.233
Bee it will be the incentive for UK to produce more of their own. Equals more employment. Certainly less canned horse meat.
  •  Guest
  • | IP XX.XXX.249.65
Continued EU will be more EU which is now clearly, and unconstitutionally, ruled by a single member state, Germany. It is no longer the EC, and Toto is No longer in Kansas. Maastricht and the Lisbon treaties buried the EC.

The Euro currency and Svenchen area - hence economic activity -are intertwined and both look unsustainable and morbid to me.

Brexit appears the best option to me, a former Europhile and still a European Britain.
Quoting Guest
Bee it will be the incentive for UK to produce more of their own. Equals more employment. Certainly less canned horse meat.

Yeah, just compare hourly wages in China and UK and think again: who would buy vastly overpriced goods manufactured in the UK, as workers' salaries are included in the final price? Customers want to buy cheap stuff - this is natural. How competitive British products would be, in your scenario?
Quoting Guest
Continued EU will be more EU which is now clearly, and unconstitutionally, ruled by a single member state, Germany. It is no longer the EC, and Toto is No longer in Kansas. Maastricht and the Lisbon treaties buried the EC.

The Euro currency and Svenchen area - hence economic activity -are intertwined and both look unsustainable and morbid to me.

Brexit appears the best option to me, a former Europhile and still a European Britain.
What is "Svenchen" area? If you refer to "Schengen", then UK is not part of it anyway.
Quoting Guest
Bee it will be the incentive for UK to produce more of their own. Equals more employment. Certainly less canned horse meat.
good luck producing in northern climates all the things that can only be produced in warm climates
  •  Guest
  • | IP XX.XX.245.44
Quoting noiko jones
good luck producing in northern climates all the things that can only be produced in warm climates
We import produce from all over the world, not just the EU. Believe it or not, the world dosn't revolve around the EU!
Quoting xy76
What is "Svenchen" area? If you refer to "Schengen", then UK is not part of it anyway.
That is correct. And there is no xexit in the plan.
We are a great trading nation. We import from all over the world and export all over the world. When we vote to leave it will still be business as usual. Trading is not going to come to a halt Don't be afraid of letting go of a political and monetary union that never did quite work. We will be free to make our own choices and not dictated to by Brussels. The EU could not even agree about what action to take with the Greek migration crisis apart from shoring up their borders and restricting the movement of people that need help.
Don't wait for the wind, take to the oars.
Quoting Pleiadian
We are a great trading nation. We import from all over the world and export all over the world. When we vote to leave it will still be business as usual. Trading is not going to come to a halt Don't be afraid of letting go of a political and monetary union that never did quite work. We will be free to make our own choices and not dictated to by Brussels. The EU could not even agree about what action to take with the Greek migration crisis apart from shoring up their borders and restricting the movement of people that need help.
Not sure who are you referring to, but let's suppose it is me. I do not think I am afraid of anything. Yes, we are a trading nation indeed. We have invented and benefited of the free market concept. Free market means free movement of goods, commodities, capital and labour. This is what has made this tiny island great,this is what has given us a competitive edge. It is the Brexit fans who are afraid. Folks who sh!t their pants because there is a shop in their street, selling foreign food, or because their dentist speaks with different accent. Folks whose brains are too small to understand the very concept of the European Community, simply because they are mentally still in the old merry England times, incapable of comprehending that Queen Victoria's reign has been long gone. I do not want UK to turn into a 19th century historical theme park, which is precisely what the Brexit flock desires.
Quoting xy76
Not sure who are you referring to, but let's suppose it is me. I do not think I am afraid of anything. Yes, we are a trading nation indeed. We have invented and benefited of the free market concept. Free market means free movement of goods, commodities, capital and labour. This is what has made this tiny island great,this is what has given us a competitive edge. It is the Brexit fans who are afraid. Folks who sh!t their pants because there is a shop in their street, selling foreign food, or because their dentist speaks with different accent. Folks...

I'm a aussie and after reading your rubbish I would say you are racist scum bag xy76
ONE MUST LEARN, DO IT AND IT WILL BE KIND TO YOU
Quoting Aussi
I'm a aussie and after reading your rubbish I would say you are racist scum bag xy76
You may be an Australian, but, judging by your post, you happen to be an idiot as well. Unless you care to prove, which part of my entry makes me racist, in your very eyes.
Quoting xy76
You may be an Australian, but, judging by your post, you happen to be an idiot as well. Unless you care to prove, which part of my entry makes me racist, in your very eyes.

Folks who sh!t their pants because there is a shop in their street, selling foreign food, or because their dentist speaks with different accent. Folks whose brains are too small to understand the very concept of the European Community, simply because they are mentally still in the old merry England times,
ONE MUST LEARN, DO IT AND IT WILL BE KIND TO YOU
If I cannot understand my friend's silence, I will never get to understand his words. Enoch Powell
Read more at: http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/e/enoch_powell.html
ONE MUST LEARN, DO IT AND IT WILL BE KIND TO YOU
Quoting xy76
You may be an Australian, but, judging by your post, you happen to be an idiot as well. Unless you care to prove, which part of my entry makes me racist, in your very eyes.
“It depends on how you define the word “racialist.” If you mean being conscious of the differences between men and nations, and from that, races, then we are all racialists. However, if you mean a man who despises a human being because he belongs to another race, or a man who believes that one race is inherently superior to another, then the answer is emphatically “No.””
ONE MUST LEARN, DO IT AND IT WILL BE KIND TO YOU
Quoting Aussi
If I cannot understand my friend's silence, I will never get to understand his words. Enoch Powell
Read more at: http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/au...ch_powell.html
So you quote here that bloody wannabe British version of Hitler, Enoch Powell, yet still dare to call me racist? Go back to hell, pal!
Quoting xy76
So you quote here that bloody wannabe British version of Hitler, Enoch Powell, yet still dare to call me racist? Go back to hell, pal!

enoch powell was never a racist now , go to hell and pal in the same sentence
ONE MUST LEARN, DO IT AND IT WILL BE KIND TO YOU
Quoting xy76
Not sure who are you referring to, but let's suppose it is me. I do not think I am afraid of anything. Yes, we are a trading nation indeed. We have invented and benefited of the free market concept. Free market means free movement of goods, commodities, capital and labour. This is what has made this tiny island great,this is what has given us a competitive edge. It is the Brexit fans who are afraid. Folks who sh!t their pants because there is a shop in their street, selling foreign food, or because their dentist speaks with different accent. Folks...
I think that you misunderstand the Brexit movement. Brexit is all for Free market means free movement of goods, commodities, capital and labour but without the political integration. Brexit is not about preventing immigration, it is about controlling it. Brexit is about providing security for the UK, which the EU cannot and does not. Brexit is about the rights of its citizens above the rights of the criminals and terrorists. The burden that the EU places on the UK and all EU countries in terms of bureaucratic regulation make us uncompetitive (400 pages, 27,000 words of regulation on apples alone). The UK is not alone in these views, yet the EU blunders on grabbing more power day by day and considers itself above the people.
Quoting Devauxt
I think that you misunderstand the Brexit movement. Brexit is all for Free market means free movement of goods, commodities, capital and labour but without the political integration. Brexit is not about preventing immigration, it is about controlling it. Brexit is about providing security for the UK, which the EU cannot and does not. Brexit is about the rights of its citizens above the rights of the criminals and terrorists. The burden that the EU places on the UK and all EU countries in terms of bureaucratic regulation make us uncompetitive (400...
thank you , you said it right
ONE MUST LEARN, DO IT AND IT WILL BE KIND TO YOU
Quoting barkie
700 million Turks will come !
I think you mean 700 million Trucks will come....
Carbon-Dioxide: the gas of life!
Quoting Stubborn
UK people : What are your views on this vote. I am talking about the pros and cons that you can think of that will affect you in general.
The pros: this man put it very well. Also DC has been exposed as doing a Syriza-move after previously advocating Brexit.

IMHO there no cons: there are only unknowns. The ruling classes would have you believe that the UK economy would evaporate in a puff of smoke. That appears to be their main argument. It is fallacious to expound the end of the world in that way. There would merely be a few bumps. It is true to say that inter-country trade within the EU has been eased immeasurably by the relaxation of cross-border paperwork. The EU is no longer a free trade zone, it is a behemoth and a mess.
Carbon-Dioxide: the gas of life!
The only thing that is certain is that the EU will become more of a country than a trade bloc and impose more of what it thinks is good for us without reference to its citizens or individual nation states and pile bureaucracy on top of bureaucracy to further enhance its own position and self importance.

Everything else we can deal with.
you all seem to forget that if you want any meaning trading relationship with the EU, and I gather that you will want that, you have to accept free movement of persons in the UK, that means any EU citizen. It's as simple as that.
I am sure that there will be lots of haggling around that, but a crucial part will be defining an EU citizen. That coupled with the ability to stop criminals and undesirables entering in the first place, that should help matters
  •  Guest
  • | IP XX.XXX.185.110
I am german and I think the Brexit supporters are right with most of their critics like building a United State of Europe without democratic legitimation, over-beaurocratic, complete failing during the financial crisis and the current migrant crisis etc. But on the other hand the EU is still a very well performing and powerful common market. And the resistance in other countries against a EU-monster state is also rising massively and quickly. Therefore the EU will anyway be forced to follow the role model of an integrated market with sovereign member states. But leaving the EU will mean no influence on the EUs market policies anymore. And that will lead to a high volatility and a bad investment climate at least short term (next 5 years or so). The volatility of the pound against the Euro may be a warning. After a Brexit and roundabout 5 years of accomodation ist quite unclear how the UK can position itself. May be like Switzerland and Norway but perhaps like Turkey, Ukraine - who knows? I would not like to face this long-term uncertainty (Think of J.M. Keynes: In the long run we are all dead.)
Quoting Guest
We import produce from all over the world, not just the EU. Believe it or not, the world dosn't revolve around the EU!
Exactly. Virtually all affordable fruit/vegetables in Canada are from Mexico and South America (Chile is 5000 miles away). US produce costs twice as much... and is exotic stuff for people who don't care what it costs.

If Canadians were forced to buy only Italian or Mediterranean produce we would be totally screwed like the UK middle class.
Quoting Guest
We import produce from all over the world, not just the EU. Believe it or not, the world dosn't revolve around the EU!
very true. Large parts of Africa would love the opportunity to export to the UK
Quoting Guest
I am german and I think the Brexit supporters are right with most of their critics like building a United State of Europe without democratic legitimation, over-beaurocratic, complete failing during the financial crisis and the current migrant crisis etc. But on the other hand the EU is still a very well performing and powerful common market. And the resistance in other countries against a EU-monster state is also rising massively and quickly. Therefore the EU will anyway be forced to follow the role model of an integrated market with sovereign member...
The EU has been well aware of the hostility towards it from the citizens of many of the other European countries and has to date made no effort to change it ways. It is unlikely to ever change its ways without a serious knock to its authority. In one way, the Brexit might help all the other EU countries regain control of the EU and turn it into what it should be.
Quoting Devauxt
I am sure that there will be lots of haggling around that, but a crucial part will be defining an EU citizen. That coupled with the ability to stop criminals and undesirables entering in the first place, that should help matters
no haggling around that I'm afraid, free movement of goods and free movement of people are two sides of the same coin, you can't have one but not the other. That is the basic premise of the EU. That is a, if not THE, fundamental pillar of the EU. I'm amazed that some people still thing that you can choose one and not the other.

How are you going to stop all the criminals and undesirables better than now? You think the UK will be allowed to have a border control in Calais to stop them like you have now? And without that control would the UK and up with a Calais in English shore?

I don't understand your doubts about the definition of a EU citizen, is that a joke?
Quoting Zer0sum
Exactly. Virtually all affordable fruit/vegetables in Canada are from Mexico and South America (Chile is 5000 miles away). US produce costs twice as much... and is exotic stuff for people who don't care what it costs.

If Canadians were forced to buy only Italian or Mediterranean produce we would be totally screwed like the UK middle class.
You still have to pay more for the stuff. Surely, is cheaper to import from Spain or Greece than from Australia
  •  Guest
  • | IP XX.XXX.185.110
Quoting Devauxt
The EU has been well aware of the hostility towards it from the citizens of many of the other European countries and has to date made no effort to change it ways. It is unlikely to ever change its ways without a serious knock to its authority. In one way, the Brexit might help all the other EU countries regain control of the EU and turn it into what it should be.
Agreed. But the british people themselve would probably not profit from this sacrifice in the short run and perhaps even not in the long run. For the british people it would be more reasonable - at least from an economic standpoint - to fight from inside the EU against the current EU misdevelopments instead of becoming an outside victim with no influence at all. In other words: A heroic sacrifice is most often not a smart solution.
You would think so, wouldn't you? But all the subsidies and reg's from the Common Agricultural Policy have not made produce cheaper from the EU, but more expensive. Importing produce from South America, Africa and Australia probably works out to be cheaper or the same as the EU prices. Even the French have started buying wine from other regions because the French stuff is too expensive
Another of EU's manufactured crisis. Anyone see a pattern? Happens during summer periods.
i think what makes produce more expensive is the cartel that big supermarkets operate and you can see examples of price rigging almost monthly. Now, who's more likely to put a break on that, the UK government, supported or too entangled with big business or a less vulnerable body of (let's not forget cause for all their faults they are still) an independent body of professionals in faraway Brussels
Quoting Devauxt
You would think so, wouldn't you? But all the subsidies and reg's from the Common Agricultural Policy have not made produce cheaper from the EU, but more expensive. Importing produce from South America, Africa and Australia probably works out to be cheaper or the same as the EU prices
Prove it, which country beats 39p for a cucumber.

http://www.mysupermarket.co.uk/grocery-categories/Cucumber_in_Aldi.html
I don't want my countries laws made by anyone other than the government the people of my country elect.
If it incurs a financial cost, so be it.
Quoting gandolf13
I don't want my countries laws made by anyone other than the government the people of my country elect.
If it incurs a financial cost, so be it.
Then shouldn't you be at Westminster and speaking to the reps, rather than commenting on FF?
Quoting barkie
Prove it, which country beats 39p for a cucumber.

http://www.mysupermarket.co.uk/groce...r_in_Aldi.html
Not being as familiar with cucumbers as you are, I can't readily give you a cheaper example as we don't import them from anywhere other than the EU at the moment. If the Brexit happens than I will be happy to oblige. In the interim this little report might help http://www.iea.org.uk/blog/abolish-the-cap-let-food-prices-tumble
Quoting gandolf13
I don't want my countries laws made by anyone other than the government the people of my country elect.
If it incurs a financial cost, so be it.
The House of Lords makes laws and they aren't elected by the people. Only one example, there are other: multinationals lobbyist, media tycoons and City bankers
Quoting noiko jones
The House of Lords makes laws and they aren't elected by the people. Only one example, there are other: multinationals lobbyist, media tycoons and City bankers
I totally agree with you, but at least with the online petitions we can force readings and discussions in Parliament and the Lords which is not the case with EU. In the UK we have some chance of influence, in the EU we have none.
  •  Guest
  • | IP XXX.XXX.93.40
The last time I looked the House of Lords can only vote to amend laws, and then the house of Commons can over rule them until the law is passed by the Commoners like you and me. i.e the un-elected house of Lords cannot make law. Unlike the un-elected EU commissioners who can and do regularly.
Quoting Devauxt
I totally agree with you, but at least with the online petitions we can force readings and discussions in Parliament and the Lords which is not the case with EU. In the UK we have some chance of influence, in the EU we have none.
Another myth.
The directly elected European Parliament approves EU legislation (proposed by the European Commission) together with the Council (the governments of the 28 EU countries). Parliament has the power to block the proposed legislation if it cannot agree with the Council.
Quoting Guest
The last time I looked the House of Lords can only vote to amend laws, and then the house of Commons can over rule them until the law is passed by the Commoners like you and me. i.e the un-elected house of Lords cannot make law. Unlike the un-elected EU commissioners who can and do regularly.
Bills (draft laws) start in either the House of Lords or House of Commons.
Quoting noiko jones
Another myth.
The directly elected European Parliament approves EU legislation (proposed by the European Commission) together with the Council (the governments of the 28 EU countries). Parliament has the power to block the proposed legislation if it cannot agree with the Council.
The EU Commission is, in effect, the EU government. It meets in secret, conducts its business in secret and keeps all its workings secret. The EU Council acts as a sort of senate. It is made up of all the prime ministers of the member states. In theory the Council holds the Commission to account on behalf of the peoples of Europe. But like the Commission it meets in secret.

The EU Parliament is presented by the EU as being the democratic forum for the people of Europe. Sadly it falls far short of this ideal. For a start it does not have anything like the powers needed by a Parliament. It is more akin to a toothless revising chamber. In theory the EU Parliament has some impressive powers, but in practice business is managed by the elites so that it never has the chance to exercise them.
  •  Guest
  • | IP XXX.XXX.8.194
I think the polls like this are rigged. Stats can tell you anything if you ask the right questions. Then you can fool or persuade those who are not sure and simply go with the flow. I vote Brexit personally and think the following is bigger than being given credit for. Hopefully we will exit and reclaim control and stop the EU running the country into the ground for the gravy train.
Quoting Devauxt
The EU Parliament is presented by the EU as being the democratic forum for the people of Europe. Sadly it falls far short of this ideal. For a start it does not have anything like the powers needed by a Parliament. It is more akin to a toothless revising chamber. In theory the EU Parliament has some impressive powers, but in practice business is managed by the elites so that it never has the chance to exercise them.
It still can block laws like when Mr Farage and other MEPs voted against an amendment to European Commission trade reforms, which by the way it may have protected the steel industry against cheap Chinese imports and avoided the collapse of Tata.
Quoting Guest
I think the polls like this are rigged. Stats can tell you anything if you ask the right questions. Then you can fool or persuade those who are not sure and simply go with the flow. I vote Brexit personally and think the following is bigger than being given credit for. Hopefully we will exit and reclaim control and stop the EU running the country into the ground for the gravy train.
"How to lie with statistics" is a book worth reading!!!
Quoting noiko jones
It still can block laws like when Mr Farage and other MEPs voted against an amendment to European Commission trade reforms, which by the way it may have protected the steel industry against cheap Chinese imports and avoided the collapse of Tata.
A very rare occurrence in the EU parliament.

In voting terms, British MEP's have a failure rate of 84%. On that basis how can the needs of the UK ever be served?

It is very hard for British MEPs to block laws because their share of the seats is simply too small to have a significant effect on the outcome of the overall vote. The two largest pan - European groups are unabashedly integrationist, so steering legislation is difficult.
  •  Guest
  • | IP XX.XX.245.44
It's a simple choice really.

Do we vote to let our country gradually become a region of an undemocratic soviet style superstate where all the power resides with an unelected and unaccountable executive, or do we vote to restore the supremacy of our elected parliament?

All the talk of trade, investment, industry, immigration etc is a sideshow in my opinion, as when you look to history and see where democracy has been undermined or abolished, it never ends well!

Democracy is the bedrock of civilisation. The ability to eject leaders who displease the electorate is and has to be paramount. Sadly I feel that the British people will fall for Cameron's con tricks and shameless scaremongering and will vote to remain in the EU, fearful that cucumbers will double in price and Ryan Air will no longer grace our shores.......
  •  Guest
  • | IP XX.XXX.134.176
Will be rigged for no exit. Politicians would never leave this decision to the public. It's all an illusion of democracy.
Quoting Guest
It's a simple choice really.

Do we vote to let our country gradually become a region of an undemocratic soviet style superstate where all the power resides with an unelected and unaccountable executive, or do we vote to restore the supremacy of our elected parliament?
That is a leading question Sir
From wikipedia "A leading question is a question which subtly prompts the respondent to answer in a particular way"
Quoting Guest
All the talk of trade, investment, industry, immigration etc is a sideshow in my opinion, as when you look to history and see where democracy has been undermined or abolished, it never ends well!
.
Also, the EU has been instrumental in bringing democracy to the countries of Eastern Europe. They wouldn't be democracies 20/30 years after communist dictatorships had the EU not been involved. It's easy to imagine all those countries taken over by nationalists or fall under Russian influence. We saw in Yugoslavia how wrong can it go.
  •  Guest
  • | IP XX.XX.245.44
Quoting noiko jones
That is a leading question Sir
From wikipedia "A leading question is a question which subtly prompts the respondent to answer in a particular way"
Leading or not, it's the issue that we should be concentrating on.
Quoting noiko jones
Also, the EU has been instrumental in bringing democracy to the countries of Eastern Europe. They wouldn't be democracies 20/30 years after communist dictatorships had the EU not been involved. It's easy to imagine all those countries taken over by nationalists or fall under Russian influence. We saw in Yugoslavia how wrong can it go.
The EU did not bring down the Berlin Wall in '89, the East Germans pushed it down. ...and in those days there was no such thing as 'a Euro', that evil token appeared in 2002, allegedly.
Carbon-Dioxide: the gas of life!
Quoting Guest
It's a simple choice really.
Excellent post.


Quote
The ability to eject leaders who displease the electorate is and has to be paramount.
...as has been shown in Zimbabwe and Syria.
Carbon-Dioxide: the gas of life!
Quoting Guest
It's a simple choice really.

Do we vote to let our country gradually become a region of an undemocratic soviet style superstate where all the power resides with an unelected and unaccountable executive, or do we vote to restore the supremacy of our elected parliament?

All the talk of trade, investment, industry, immigration etc is a sideshow in my opinion, as when you look to history and see where democracy has been undermined or abolished, it never ends well!

Democracy is the bedrock of civilisation. The ability to eject leaders who...
This is so true. The European Parliament has, since its inception, been dominated by two parties committed to further European integration; the left-leaning Socialist and Democrat Party and the centre right European People’s Party. Despite the tendency of the European Parliament to allow smaller parties a voice, the two parties remain effectively unchallenged. They are committed to “ever closer union” and interpret the Lisbon treaty along federalist lines, presuming in 2013 to nominate candidates for the Commission Presidency.

In the Parliament (2009-14), the two parties together constituted 458 seats; 60 per cent of those available. Both tended to act as champions of European integration, supporting almost every measure advanced by the European Commission.

The EU is a cabal of integrationists. When you can guarantee 60% of most votes, you have nothing to worry about. You can plough ahead with any policy you like, those little Englanders have no chance
UK existed long before EU and EU now says UK will suffer on Brexit..??

it's like the kid telling the father that he will not survive if he leaves the family....

Those shouting against brexit are none other than those unelected officials...

They will lose their jobs....
Quoting ahyau
UK existed long before EU and EU now says UK will suffer on Brexit..??

it's like the kid telling the father that he will not survive if he leaves the family....

Those shouting against brexit are none other than those unelected officials...

They will lose their jobs....
you mean the father telling the kid?
those unelected officials shouting against Brexit can't vote in the UK
the whole Brexit argument makes me so sad really, it's all about ignorance, wishful thinking, narrow-mindness. I still haven't seen a single argument to leave that makes any sense geopolitically or otherwise.
Quoting Exodus
The EU did not bring down the Berlin Wall in '89, the East Germans pushed it down. ...and in those days there was no such thing as 'a Euro', that evil token appeared in 2002, allegedly.
notice that I didn't mention the Euro, your subsconscience betrays you
Quoting noiko jones
notice that I didn't mention the Euro, your subsconscience betrays you
The Euro has become a symbol of European dogma.
Carbon-Dioxide: the gas of life!
EU comes after UK...so EU is the kid, UK is the father...and the kid is kidding the father that he cannot survive if he leaves ??

Politicians always say ridiculous things.... like the world will come to a halt if they are not elected or people walk out on them...

If there is any recession in any country, the first group of people to retrench should be the politicians...
Quoting xy76
Not sure who are you referring to, but let's suppose it is me. I do not think I am afraid of anything. Yes, we are a trading nation indeed. We have invented and benefited of the free market concept. Free market means free movement of goods, commodities, capital and labour. This is what has made this tiny island great,this is what has given us a competitive edge. It is the Brexit fans who are afraid. Folks who sh!t their pants because there is a shop in their street, selling foreign food, or because their dentist speaks with different accent. Folks...
You started off well, then you proceeded to insult everyone in the UK. Oh dear, small mindedness and disrespectful.
Don't wait for the wind, take to the oars.
Actually Pleiadian I believe you are correct. This part concerning "It is the Brexit fans who are afraid"is totally wrong. The consequences of Brexit are not entirely known, and therefore to show willingness to face the unknown is anything but afraid.
Carbon-Dioxide: the gas of life!
Quoting Exodus
Actually Pleiadian I believe you are correct. This part concerning "It is the Brexit fans who are afraid"is totally wrong. The consequences of Brexit are not entirely known, and therefore to show willingness to face the unknown is anything but afraid.
Very well said. It shows remarkable courage that nearly 50% of the electorate (according to some polls) believe in Britain's resourcefulness, capability, ingenuity and resilience over the bullying bureaucrats in the EU. It is a shame that so many of the Political class have no longer got the cahonas they were born with.
politicians never believe in their people... only leaders do... Politicians only believe in elections and how to win elections...to keep their jobs..
Quoting Pleiadian
You started off well, then you proceeded to insult everyone in the UK. Oh dear, small mindedness and disrespectful.
I do not think so. It is but a tiny fraction of our society, which matches the description and cannot handle the truth. I feel sorry for you...
Splitters are done, 3 years of Brexit drama and in the end there is nothing to show for.

As expected, so let's move on to Grexit 5, 6 and 7 and don't waste our valuable time on this non event.


http://www.ncpolitics.uk/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/uk-eu-referendum-odds-20160519-1024x516.jpg
Quoting barkie
Splitters are done, 3 years of Brexit drama and in the end there is nothing to show for.

As expected, so let's move on to Grexit 5, 6 and 7 and don't waste our valuable time on this non event.


http://www.ncpolitics.uk/wp-content/...9-1024x516.jpg
You should lead by example
Quoting Devauxt
Very well said. It shows remarkable courage that nearly 50% of the electorate (according to some polls) believe in Britain's resourcefulness, capability, ingenuity and resilience over the bullying bureaucrats in the EU. It is a shame that so many of the Political class have no longer got the cahonas they were born with.
you are a cliche machine gun mate. say something clever backed by facts
For example,
Fact1: there are around 33,000 civil servants in the EU (http://ec.europa.eu/civil_service/docs/hr_key_figures_2016.pdf)
Fact 2: there are 440,000 civil servants in the UK (https://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peopleinwork/publicsectorpersonnel/bulletins/civilservicestatistics/2015-10-08)

another cliche is "unelected EU bureaucrats" but I don't remember voting for UK civil servants ever
Quoting noiko jones
you are a cliche machine gun mate. say something clever backed by facts
For example,
Fact1: there are around 33,000 civil servants in the EU (http://ec.europa.eu/civil_service/do...gures_2016.pdf)
Fact 2: there are 440,000 civil servants in the UK (https://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentand...ics/2015-10-08)

another cliche is "unelected EU bureaucrats" but I don't remember voting for UK civil servants ever
But we do elect the politicians who are responsible for the departments within the civil service giving us some say, but to be truthful, not enough. But even this is not true of the EU.

A Study back in 2008 by Open Europe found that 170,000 people work for EU institutions. The group claimed that the difficulty of finding out how many officials worked in Brussels showed a lack of transparency and left the EU open to "influence from lobbyists."
Open Europe said the figure is nearly six times more than the 32,000 Brussels bureaucrats which EU bosses have traditionally claimed are needed to run the EU.

The Commission has previously claimed that its bureaucratic employees are "fewer than the number of staff employed by a typical medium-sized city council in Europe."
However, the new figure, including EU staff working remotely from Brussels, is more like the entire population of a small city such as Swansea or Portsmouth.
Quoting noiko jones
you are a cliche machine gun mate. say something clever backed by facts
For example,
Fact1: there are around 33,000 civil servants in the EU (http://ec.europa.eu/civil_service/do...gures_2016.pdf)
Fact 2: there are 440,000 civil servants in the UK (https://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentand...ics/2015-10-08)

another cliche is "unelected EU bureaucrats" but I don't remember voting for UK civil servants ever
....only 440,000
But what about the 1.7m people employed by/in the NHS ... or do they not count as public servants. I suppose they could be different from civil servants, some of them do not seem entirely happy....
Carbon-Dioxide: the gas of life!
Open Europe is a Eurosceptic campaigning organization with links to the Daily Telegraph, and other Eurosceptic groups, not independent by any means. I'd take what they say with a pinch of salt.
http://powerbase.info/index.php/Open_Europe
http://www.economist.com/blogs/charlemagne/2010/03/spoon_feeding_lazy_journalists
Quoting noiko jones
Open Europe is a Eurosceptic campaigning organization with links to the Daily Telegraph, and other Eurosceptic groups, not independent by any means. I'd take what they say with a pinch of salt.
http://powerbase.info/index.php/Open_Europe
http://www.economist.com/blogs/charl...zy_journalists
And the EU's own statistics are not biased at all???????

Open Europe arrives at its figure by adding the 48,000 employed at the EU’s core institutions (the Commission, Parliament, Council, Court of Justice) to the 5,000
employed by other EU institutions such as the ECB, the Court of Auditors, the Economic and Social Committee, and those employed by the numerous Community Agencies, such as the Community Fisheries Control Agency, the European Aviation Safety Agency and the European Medicines Agency. To this figure is added the 173 employed by the agencies of the Common Foreign and Security Policy, the 745 employed in agencies dealing with police and judicial cooperation, the 1,200 people employed by the EU’s executive agencies such as the Research Executive Agency and the Executive Agency for Competitivness, the 62,000 members of Expert Groups, and the 10,500 employed at the EU’s overseas missions in Kosovo, Bosnia, the Congo and elsewhere. Finally, Open Europe adds in those in the national bureaucracies who are employed to implement the EU’s regulations and directives. This number, based on a recent paper by Dr Michael Haller, is put at 17,900 to 36,200 which gives a grand total of 151,232 to 169,532. However, there are reasons for thinking that this could very well be a conservative estimate.

If you know any of these figures to be incorrect, I will be happy to take it up with them
It is no wonder that more than €133.6 billion of European Union budget payments last year were "affected by material error". The European Court of Auditors failed to give the EU budget a clean bill of health for the 21st year running. They can't even account for everyone employed by them
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Damned if they remain, damned if they leave... One thing is for sure... Europe is on the brink of collapse and collapse it will under the weight of debt. Nearly 10 years since the financial crash and the next one is just around the corner.. Draghi with his NIRP ensured that the EU are on this road now. Things are going to get a lot worse in Europe and a Brexit would only speed this process up.
Please stop Devaux it's embarrassing.

Even your main sources of "information" feel the heat now, it's over and what an easy win for Bremain it was !

http://www.theguardian.com/media/greenslade/2016/may/19/three-newspapers-to-be-reported-to-ipso-over-inaccurate-eu-stories
Quoting barkie
Please stop Devaux it's embarrassing.

Even your main sources of "information" feel the heat now, it's over and what an easy win for Bremain it was !

http://www.theguardian.com/media/gre...ate-eu-stories
NEVER
Quoting Exodus
....only 440,000
But what about the 1.7m people employed by/in the NHS ... or do they not count as public servants. I suppose they could be different from civil servants, some of them do not seem entirely happy....

...and what does their unhappiness have to do with the EU?
with all the fear mongering trade deal threats from EU and Obama if Britain leaves, it's quite clear Britain is far more important to the EU than the EU is to Britain, even if as nothing more than a status of unity with the major outsiders. Otherwise, why would they bother to make a big thing of it?? They have shown their hand
Britain leaving would be quite a precendent, Just imagine if they left and made a good go of it on their own.
The EU cards would start to tumble (and they know it)
Come with me if you want to live....
I love this article, Junker reckons he is not making threats when he says Britain would get killed in trade negotiations if they leave....lol....

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3600907/Deserters-not-welcomed-open-arms-Brussels-chief-issues-stark-threat-EU-punish-Britain-vote-leave.html

Yeah, and I'm the Alien Zurg, the sworn enemy of the Galactic Alliance BAAAAAH........... HA HA HA HA HA HA

https://youtu.be/tdxR-4Wf4Z8

Oh Buzzz....
Come with me if you want to live....
A must read http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3603793/Why-quit-EU-Cameron-s-guru-Friend-strategist-Steve-Hilton-breaks-ranks-Brexit-say-Britain-literally-ungovernable-unless-power-self-serving-elite.html
Quoting Devauxt
A must read http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ing-elite.html
Excellent!
Carbon-Dioxide: the gas of life!
Quoting Devauxt
A must read http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ing-elite.html
Great!
Quoting Devauxt
A must read http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ing-elite.html
From that beacon of good journalism and serious and independent analysis The Daily Mail, other headlines from the front page:

"The most brazen WAG of all: Three children by three dads. A fling with Peter Andre. No wonder England football hero Jamie Vardy's parents WON'T be at his wedding today"

"The odd pair! Zayn Malik wears bizarre mismatched shoes as he leaves girlfriend Gigi Hadid at home to enjoy energetic hike with pretty mystery blonde"

"Keeping the romance alive! Beyonce sports girly maxi dress as she holds hands with Jay Z during dinner date in New York"

If this is where the Brexiters are getting their information from, it's no wonder they look so confused.
Quoting noiko jones
From that beacon of good journalism and serious and independent analysis The Daily Mail, other headlines from the front page:

"The most brazen WAG of all: Three children by three dads. A fling with Peter Andre. No wonder England football hero Jamie Vardy's parents WON'T be at his wedding today"

"The odd pair! Zayn Malik wears bizarre mismatched shoes as he leaves girlfriend Gigi Hadid at home to enjoy energetic hike with pretty mystery blonde"

"Keeping the romance alive! Beyonce sports girly maxi dress as she holds hands with Jay Z during...
I know that the DM is a comic, but Steve Hilton is no joke. He is Godfather to one of David Cameron's children, one of DC's closest friends in politics and has a lot to lose in saying what he has.
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  • Posted: May 17, 2016 8:54am
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     OANDA
    Category: Fundamental Analysis
    Comments: 97  /  Views: 15,261